+ Register

[WorldBaccaratKing]

I think most will agree basic strategy doesn't work anymore.....

I have basic strategy down and I lose 90% of the time I play BJ. We have double deck, 6 and 8 deck tables. It don't matter what table. I can play 1-1 or I play 2 hands and I get killed....

I have also counted using the hi-low method, KO blackjack, etc. I think they don't work because basic strategy is stuff now....Why else would a casino sell these cards to the public?

Love to hear your thoughts....

[roversi13]

I used Red Seven count(asymmetrical count) and BS from Stanford Wong
But:
-bet 1 - 5 units according with the count (for instance 30 - 150 € or more )
-no bet before 2 remaining decks (no sit down or sit down,play minimum bet,10 €, and when favourable count 1 -5 bet(30 - 150 € or more)Dangerous:you can have 1 or 2 very bad shoe(unfavorable count) and lose 10 € several times in a row,even with double,splitting....bad scenario!
-bkr 30 units,stop win 6 - 10 units at the most

Boring, possible drawdown,difficult recovery but after 100 sessions + or - 10/20 units.
Become neither rich nor poor.

[WorldBaccaratKing]

do you agree basic strategy is no good? I do. Basis strategy was made by millions of hands dealt consecutively. Well, I don't play with continuous shuffle machines so BS makes no sense......

[Jimske]

I think most will agree basic strategy doesn't work anymore.....Love to hear your thoughts....

Basic Strategy NEVER worked. 

[Jimske]

The two most problematic things about normal casino blackjack:

1) It's very exhausting to keep track of all the cards.  A young man with a knack for it could properly keep it up for a couple of hours every other day.

It's not tiring at all.  In fact one gets to the point where it is done automatically.  Like breathing.  You don't have to think about breathing.  With practice you get to that point where you're not really thinking about it.  It just happens.

2) Such a person naturally gets too good, and too comfortable or smooth about it.  That stands out as well

The only thing that stands out is the spread when one all of a suddenly begins to raise the bets disproportionately to what you've been doing.  So a card counter puts on an act and/or does a hit and run thing.  One of my early mentors used to say, "I love to lose."   That way he was able to pretend to be steaming and could get away with laying out some big bets at the right time.

When I gave it up back in 2000, I could just about tell you the next card out of the shoe. By then, most casinos had very strict limits on what they would let slide.

How can I say this nicely?  Nonsense to being able to predict the actual next card!  That's not what counting is all about except for the "Rainman" autistic types or maybe some one in a million photo memory folks.  So you weren't a card counter at all.  If you could do that then you'd still be playing the game.  It would be fairly easy to gain a positive edge without spreading 15:1 or higher.

Even wonging was out.

Wonging is out because most casinos have no mid-shoe entry rules.

But there is a way to reduce the spread and conceal counting using "clump" techniques and monitoring the running count and position of play but . . . this is largely a guess more than a prediction.  Still can provides an advantage.

For me the frustration of BJ was threefold.  Poor penetration, small edge and too many players on the table. 

J

[tdx]

Playing BJ is a waste of time.  Can't raise your bets on a positive count or casino will bar you.......takes tremendous concentration,,,,most shoes are negative count and you have to sit through them and bet every hand.......requires very large bankroll......you can go on losing streaks which lasts for weeks or months.......guaranteed you will lose half your bankroll ( or all of it ) at some point in time.

Only way to win is with a counting team and only bet on positive shoes like the MIT team or Ken Uston's team in the early 1970's .......but casinos are wise to that too.

Better off staying at your day job at Mcdonalds.

[soxfan]

Back about 26 year ago I was a member of a very good bj card counting squad. We made great cake for around 11 month all over the state of Nevada before the enterprise came apart as a result of the personality conflicts. Back then there were PLENTY of great sd and dd bj games with great penetrations and mid shoe enterings. Sadly, those days are long gone and with the shoe games, lousy rule, no mid-shoe enterings and sweaty joints, I wouldn't even try to count card these days. And that is especially true as there is much better, easier cake to be made at the baccarats.

And remember, Ian Andersen, one of the best card counter of all time once got clipped for a 1500 units downdraws, hey hey.

[Jimske]

Back about 26 year ago I was a member of a very good bj card counting squad. We made great cake for around 11 month all over the state fo Nevada before the enterprise came apart as a result of the personality conflicts. Back then there were PLENTY of great sd and dd bj games with great penetrations and mid shoe enterings. Sadly, those days are long gone and with the shoe games, lousy rule, no mid-shoe enterings and sweaty joints, I would even try to count card these days. And that is especially true as there is much better, easier cake to be made at the baccarats.

And remember, Ian Andersen, one of the best card counter of all time once got clipped for a 1500 units downdraws, hey hey.

Even the MIT team lost a million bucks before they made it the second time around.  Yeah, playing teams requires a lot of loyalty.  My most memorable play was when I lost 12 out of 14 big bet hands in the same long session!

YUP, the good games long gone.  It's the rules but mostly about penetration.  Shuffle tracking could still be viable if you could find a casino that doesn't plug and takes big enough picks but that may be hard to find - I don't know - got to look around at the games.  Still ways to win as I alluded to previously.  But again, full tables no good.  What would be nice if you could get 3 guys playing partners on the table with late surrender face up game.  1st base would be the "big" player while the other two would pay rent and attempt to draw out the low cards.  In the meantime all would play the high count when and if it occurred.  A problem here is dealing with high cards coming out beginning of the shoe so you got to be on your toes.  Anyway, that's a primer for modern BJ play.  A lot more too it.  But . . . can you find a game?  And also . . . you'd still have to hit and run less you'd get the boot after awhile.

No real need to play anything but simple hi-lo in shoe games.  The coefficient of performance for betting and drawing tend to even out the advantage for using a more complicated count.

[soxfan]

If I had to count then I'd just go with the K-O style. It is much easier than other style and just about as profitable, hey hey.

[soxfan]

What I don't get, how you went from that to a simple parlay betting progression in baccarat. Something doesn't add up.

Anyway, I always thought that the best way to get away with something was to do it alone.  It ain't easy to look stupid.

What's so hard to comprehend, hey hey?