Fact; Casino Cheats At Baccarat

[HunchBacShrimp]

You're wasting your time in this thread, HBS.....fighting an unwinnable battle vs obvious trolling.

Yeah, It started out as a bit of entertainment for myself. Yes, I'm that bored. This guys got less of an accusation of cheating, than he has a whining for losing.

Hey, Adulay, I'll refrain from resorting to name calling as a means to provoke a discussion. Maybe[smiley]aes/joking.png[/smiley] Though I certainly feel this guy warranted some of it and qualifies for some of it too.

Nobody ever had fun following 'the rules'. I won't do my best  but I'll put for some effort not to break them next time.

HBS

[Wewin2222]

This rant that you have displayed will all be pie in your face. The casino thinks they will never get caught, after all it is their house and they control everything. However I beg to differ the crook always gets caught in the end. Your anger in the threads you have posted only proves to everyone on here that every word I have stated is true and you drive the truth deeper & deeper with every thread you post.

[ADulay]

This rant that you have displayed will all be pie in your face. The casino thinks they will never get caught, after all it is their house and they control everything. However I beg to differ the crook always gets caught in the end. Your anger in the threads you have posted only proves to everyone on here that every word I have stated is true and you drive the truth deeper & deeper with every thread you post.

I think I may have a solution to your current problem.

Try a little decaf in the morning.

I'd like to think that most people would like to see this "discussion" move along, but unless you can come up with some kind of citation or link to what you continue to state as "fact", it's just kind of pointless.

Just my thoughts on the matter.  Nothing to see here.  Move along.

Personally I would LOVE to see 7 or 8 "3's" not break when I'm at the table!!

AD

[Jimske]

This rant that you have displayed will all be pie in your face. The casino thinks they will never get caught, after all it is their house and they control everything. However I beg to differ the crook always gets caught in the end. Your anger in the threads you have posted only proves to everyone on here that every word I have stated is true and you drive the truth deeper & deeper with every thread you post.

You should hook up with Al.  You guys are on the same page.

[Rolex-Watch]

You should hook up with Al.  You guys are on the same page.

Call it paranoia, but some weird sh1t goes on in casino's, that will truly mind-f%*k you.

About 4 times this week, I've lost a few bets, stepped things up a bit, then BANG.  You get hit by 3 x N9's on the opposing side you are betting, stop betting, bet the other side, N9 to the other side (Bacc terminal).

Of course anything can happen, HOWEVER when the same thing happens over and over and over again, you begin to wonder [seriously]. Last night playing a marathon just as I closed in on my goal target, same thing happens at least twice, not a bunch of losing hands, rather getting battered by N9's.

It was ludicrous, sitting at a Baccarat terminal, you have a big bet on the player which is on 7, and you can predict the dealer will pull the card out of the angel shoe, I say to the guy sitting next to me, "here come the 9", BANG 100% correct.  Called them for all kinds, cheating c&^ts, b@$t@a3ds, in a low voice of course, just enough to send the message.

Casino's will cheat to boost profit margins, 1..5% sometimes isn't enough, proving it is another matter.

As I've said to many players, it is not about losing, rather how you lose (timing, barbecued "losing 7-6" too often), and of course the precise shuffling of the Angel gear.
9
I had an abundance of shoes yesterday that were basically in equilibrium for the entire shoe (60^2) , mathematically that is OFF THE RICHTER SCALE, how is it possible to beat odds that are 77% the players favour over and over and over for a 12 hand sequence??  Of course anything is possible, but over and over again?  With the EPROM driven Angel technology anything is possible and IMO if casinos want to increase their bottom line, they will explore and investigate, because they are the bottom feeders of the cesspool.

While I don't like clutter my mind with such stuff and prefer to avoid such nonsense, but when things start to happen too often, it is good to keep your wits about you. 


Yeah I did manage to turn things around, but more remarkable was watching a very drunk novice player come to the table with about $400, didn't understand the game, kept asking why some hands took additional cards and some didn't.  The guy couldn't lose, staggering to watch as he turned $400 into about $4600.  I was chatting away to him at about 10am, so I said breakfast is on you mat8, after I strongly advised him his luck might run out and do the opposite of what the casino wants you to do and cash out.

We have a good chat and nice breakky :-)



 

[Big EZ]

My opinion .....


I think the only casinos that CAN cheat are the Indian casinos here in the states.  They are regulated by themselves and only themselves.

[alrelax]

My opinion .....


I think the only casinos that CAN cheat are the Indian casinos here in the states.  They are regulated by themselves and only themselves.

If you want some cold hard factual history, look up the tribe that started it all.  The Seminole's in Hollywood Florida. 

I just happened to grow up there in Hollywood as well.  My daughter just happened to work her way up under Charlie Tiger and then she became an upper ranking corp. exec with Seminole and was in charge of Rules and Compliance there for numerous years and now she is off to Vegas.

Do your own research and read about how Chief Billie turned it over to Howard Tommie and his history of the tribe and their secret management companies, etc., etc.  Look up the guy that arrested the chief and Trbal Counsel when it all started, he was the Sheriff of Broward County (the county that premiered in the show 'COPS') and he chased the tribe for years.  He eventually became the Attorney General of Florida, Robert Butterworth.  He was never at a shortage about the cheating and the dishonesty of the Tribe that raped multi hundreds-of-millions.  The story is not over yet.

BTW, The chief does not live on the reservation in western Hollywood.  The chief lives across from his x-wife, almost directly across the street.  In Fort Lauderdale, on the extreme east side overlooking the ocean and intercostal waterways in a pair of mansions.

But of course asked Rolex, I don't know anything, I live in the past, I tell stories and I did not go to Hollywood Hills High School which was on Sterling Road about 1/4 miles east of the reservation at 441/State Road 7.  Nope, not me.

[Wewin2222]

Casino's do use a card reader; Fact!!!!, They rob good people day in and day out; Fact!!!!, They will be prosecuted for this one day; Fact!!

[Wewin2222]

The only thing I am asking the Casino to do is wash the cards and hand shuffle; However they will never do this because they have to much of an advantage with their card reader.

[Wewin2222]

It's only a matter of time, probably sooner than latter until this dark secret blows up in their face!!!!!!!

[gr8player]

It was ludicrous, sitting at a Baccarat terminal.......
I had an abundance of shoes yesterday that were basically in equilibrium for the entire shoe (60^2) , mathematically that is OFF THE RICHTER SCALE, how is it possible to beat odds that are 77% the players favour over and over and over for a 12 hand sequence??  Of course anything is possible, but over and over again?  With the EPROM driven Angel technology anything is possible and IMO if casinos want to increase their bottom line, they will explore and investigate, because they are the bottom feeders of the cesspool.

Johno, if I may inquire, "Baccarat terminal" and "EPROM driven Angel technology"....what sort of Baccarat game is this, exactly?

If it is some sort of "computer driven" results, in that case, I, too, would be very skeptical.  I have a casino called Resorts World that is local to me, but I opt for the three hour drive to AC or CT to play in front of a live dealer rather than trust any money risked at those "Baccarat machines".

I am of the opinion that they can (and will) skew the results into their favor whenever they might feel the need to.  Not for me.

[soxfan]

Say a cat winning regular at the baccarats and he takes a thousand or coupla thousands profit outta the joint per day, on average. Ain't no reputable mortars and bricks outfit gonna sweat that action and risk losing their licence by cheating customer. Only whining losers and system sellers prattle on about casino orchestrations and cheating, hey hey.

[HunchBacShrimp]

Ah, I can't believe you breathed life into this thread.

I have this conversation because of my gambling experience and understanding percentages and random with local people about the weather all the time. The weather is hard to predict. So when it says only 20% chance of rain, and then it rains, you should hear these people go on and on how it shouldn't be raining. It was only a 20% chance. The weatherman is an unintelligent blah blah blah. I have to point out to them that 20% is still a chance. It didn't say 0% chance of rain. It still has a 1 in 5 chance to rain, and that's a relatively good chance. Plus it isn't raining across the entire state, it is not like a giant thunderstorm the size of the entire state is rolling in dropping 5 inches of rain. (not every shoe in the house is simultaneously defying a 77% chance)

I try not to get hung up in the score. It means nothing. The end result is all that matters. It's got to be selective memory. Do you recall all the times you pulled an 9 vs the other sides 8? Do you really think you are on the losing side of this wager more than 50% of the time? Does management come down and accuse of cheating or reshuffle the deck when your side has monkey duece and pulls a monkey for a total of two, and the other side has nine three for a total of two and pulls a nine for a total of 1, and you win with that 2?

Plus it makes no sense for the casino to try and cheat back your win goal right before you leave and award the drunk guy next to you several times that amount. When he would be the easy target, the guy who doesn't understand the draw rules.

It's just like the dealers saying Player shouldn't win by 12 decisions, Banker has the advantage. It isn't that strong of an advantage, it is very slight, and yet Player still streaks to 20 as well. All bet selections can be compared to a long streak. Sometimes they are going to win again and again and again and not collect an equal amount of losses any time soon in the same manner, and other times they are going to lose and lose and lose and not recover an equal amount of wins any time soon in the same manner.

It's just part of random. You play it long enough and you will see its extremes. If you don't ever see the extremes of random, over a very long (don't ask how long) period of time, then your not playing a random game.

The very same thing happened to me the other night. I expect my side to win, it's not doubled, or singled or hit the 3h or whatever for like 5or 6 attempts and Player gets 6 and stands and banker gets 7 no draw. Or worse! I'm on Banker a bunch, with a 4 5 or 6, and the Player keeps pulling a non draw card and winning by 1. If not outright drawing a N8 or N9 to begin with. And my comeback was betting against the table and my side winning by 1 and the very low end of the spectrum. 1-0 or 2-1. The whole table moaning and groaning as my side gets a crappy draw but there side always getting reduced from a 3 or less.

Of course all of this is part of my non-fiction novel according to wewin222 as I'm actually part of global casino management.
FACT!!!  [smiley]aes/money.png[/smiley]

Let me say, I also would have some apprehension about playing at a terminal if I couldn't see the shoe, or worse, the shoe was actually a continuous shuffle machine. I can't see how a card reader would be necessary in a shuffle machine but even if there was one. Once the player cuts the cards it changes the order. It also changes the value of the burn card, which again changes the order.

HBS

[tdx]

Live casinos have auto shufflers and each card has an RF  identifier so the shuffler can detect which exact card, if any, is missing -   also some new chips at the WYNN in vegas have chips with an RF identifier so the casino can keep track of the chips.

So if you are playing at a bac machine with no live dealer like Resorts in Queens NY, the machine can select any card it needs depending on how much is bet on Player or Banker....all the while looking like its taking the next card out of the shoe........which it really is not.

With a live dealer, once the cards are in the shoe, they can't be taken out of the shoe and re-shuffled or the dealer can't take "seconds" out of the shoe like a blackjack dealer can.

The dealer and the casino do not know how the 6 or 7 customers at the table will play so it would be hard to rig the cards, Some may bet on chops, others on a trend etc etc.

Rigging a blackjack shoe is easy...just make sure the dealer gets an 18, 19 20 or 21 on almost every hand.  Someone I know played blackjack at an Indian casino and won only 4 hands in a 8 deck shoe of blackjack.  Was the shoe rigged? Who knows ? Maybe or maybe not.

As far as cheating goes, live casinos are more worried about dealers and customers playing partners..... or customers past posting bets from seat # 8
or dealers or supervisors stealing chips from the chip tray. I can tell some good stories about these situations.

The only real way an auto shuffler in a live casino can screw a customer in baccarat is to somehow rig the deck so there are no long Player or Banker runs.

And yes...the Indian casinos have their own sureveillance and monitoring of the integrity of the game......so anything is possible with the Indian casinos.......a good way to get back at the Americans who stole their land, gave them smallpox, killed them and their buffaloes and starved them to death. 

PS Recently an Indian tribal member was indicted foe embezzelling almost  a million $ from a tribal fund.........you just can't trust anyone when it comes to money.

[HunchBacShrimp]

Alrelax,

I looked up Buttersworth. Read some stuff about him against Indian reservation bingo halls. Unclear what his motivations were, can't say I'm a fan of wanting to arrest non Indians from gambling on reservations. Which is the same as me gambling in another country. It's not illegal. Plus Florida has dog racing tracks and Jai Alai gambling, the latter of which has been suspected of being fixed. I've gambled there before and don't like it. No mention of Buttersworth vs the gambling industry in his state, just against the Indians doing it.

I'm sure it's all about regulation and taxes. And less of a moral high ground. I saw a picture of Chief I cheat you's house by the ocean. Sure I agree, he doesn't need a 9million dollar jet. I imagine the management companies were rampant with corruption too. His 12million a year seems unnecessary as the Indian citizens, who are supposed to be benefiting from the revenue surely aren't getting anything except pocket change.

It is a fine example of what self regulation produces.

Personally, I'm not against reservations having full fledged casinos. But, if they are open to US citizens, on land fully encompassed by US soil, then a separate entity of NON Indians, a US gaming commission, should be regulating the action. Making sure all the games are fair. Cards, dice, slots etc.

BTW, the best course of action would be to allow full fledged gambling in Florida, thus cutting off the need for US citizens to go on a tax free reservation.

HBS