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[Bally6354]

Al, the last shoe you posted would be a decent one for me. Everyone probably reads things slightly differently and I narrowed it down to three sections which at least would have made it a profitable shoe for myself.

From hand 15 to hand 30 (excluding any ties which I don't get involved in)

BB
PP
BB
PP
BB
PP
BB
PP

That's a good run for the 2's in a continuous fashion and the upside of them is you are not having to take a couple of losses along the way.

Hand 31 to 43...

P
P
P
B
P
P
P
P
P
P
P
P
P

I love attacking when there is a weak side of singles. The 1-2 neg progression is my go to here although I try to look out for when it morphs into more of chop outcomes as well.

Hand 46 to 56...

P
B
B
B
B
B
P
B
B
P
B

It switched over from dominant P's to dominant B's.

And so hands 15 through to 56 produced three very strong sections one after the other where anybody alert would have had little trouble to come out ahead.

[alrelax]

Thx for pic/post alrelax.

Re: First pic with 14B streak. Interesting tote board and mostly typical until that 14B streak. ..............



IMO and contrary to what some may think that most players would have made thousands. If I was a betting man (and I am) I would bet that several of my typical daily table mates would have busted on that 14B run by running a Marty as anti-B. Probably 1 or 2 players would have been riding the B streak, though probably not pressing on each win to the end. Hopefully I am wrong with this hypothesis.

...........

.............



Personally, I would have possibly looked to the immediate left at the two 4iar columns and the P/T column further to the left and concluded there was a recent shelf at 4 and would have made two attempts anti-B (e.g., 1u, 2.1u), stopped, and possibly made two more attempts anti-B at or near the 7th/8th tier, then watched it to the end. "Maybe" placed a B wager and let it ride (but no pressing).

Hopefully someone would have extracted huge sums of cash. Unfortunately, I do not think it would have been me.


Continued Success,

Where I play, most capitalize on banker clumps and streaks, at least the highest majority do however they lose all or most of their winnings when the same thing happens with the players side. This is a perpetual roundabout with most players at the places I frequent.

But, great players IMO wager both the B and the P sides without the proverbial media reference to the banker only advantages, etc.  After all, most strong shoes have almost certain fairness to both sides.

This particular Banker streak of 14 as I said, after the first tie I think just about everybody switched to the player side except myself and another person. Several switched after the second tie, as well as the third tie. 

I would say at least four of us had at least $30,000 collectively combined on every banker hand after the fifth Banker hand won. I would say the whole table had between $40,000-$50,000 on every single hand wagering on the Banker side. 

Most did get hurt on the players side that followed but camaraderie helped a few at the table. There was a couple of us that were strong about how the players side  would make a direct answer and follow up to that long banker streak.

You talk about looking at the two 4-IAR for Banker and the player/tie at a recent shelf of four also.  This is why I limit/curtail my decisions of the highest majority of times to sections. It changes. Almost always does. It lasts for only a certain amount of times.

Yes, some good money was profited in the streak of bankers as well as within the players side clumping at the end.  Likewise money was lost as well as not being made by a few watching in disbelief.  And sadly, about half of those that won on the bankers streak, gave it right back plus on those 13 following players. 

[Bally6354]

It makes no sense to ignore the Player side, I just don't get that at all. How is someone going to take advantage of the 2's, a long chop or just a good old fashioned dominant P side. Where I play, they mostly follow Bank because there is a Banker bonus which ranges from 2k to about 20k where depending on how many consecutive Bankers you get, a bonus is triggered and then it goes up to a maximum of 12 and you win the jackpot. Just the fact that the casinos are actively encouraging it would make me think twice, lol.

We can probably all agree that because the B outcome is more likely than the P outcome, longer B events occur more frequently than longer P events, while shorter P events (especially 1s P) occur more frequently than shorter B events. But we also know that anything and everything can happen on any specific shoe that you are going to encounter and so to completely take out roughly 50% of the decisions is surely going to hinder your play, no?

[AsymBacGuy]

I agree.
I do know some long term winners playing both sides, nobody I know wins by only wagering Banker.

as.

[alrelax]

Here we go, from last night.  Equalling out without a doubt!

9 Ps 5 Bs before banker streak of 10.

9 Ps  15 Bs end of B streak. The 2 ties were, 1) Natural8/Natural 8. 2) Player face/5 pulls 5.  Bankers 10/3 pulls 7. 

13 Ps  19 Bs before the two clumps of Ps.

23Ps  20 Bs after the second clump of Ps.  The 3 ties were all natural ties in that second clump.

27 Ps 23 Bs before the 6 Bs IAR with one F-7.

27 Ps 29 Bs end of the 6 IAR Bankers.

End of picture count 30 Ps and 32 Bs.  Next hand was the 4th F7 and then one additional banker came. 

Note.  The 2 matching 5 chop chop events.  First, hands 53-58 and second, hands 68-74. Personally love to match up those smaller chop events and wager for the second P or B to continue down.

Count.  30 Ps 34 Bs.  13 Ties. 

Last event was 4 P IAR.

Count.  34 Ps.  34 Bs.  13 Ties.  Total 81 hands.

Top Row Bead Plate.  1st spot was Player.  All others straight across were Bankers.  Very last one was Players.

F7s at hands: 32-45-63-75.

That road where 6 IAR Ps occurred. Most of the table switched to be B after the fifth and then the tie came.  They stayed on B with the verbal, "look" (and pointing), at the five IAR in the very beginning.  Then another P came out.  They switched back to players except one other and myself.  F7 won!  You could cut the frustration with a knife!  Then they all went heavy on B.  Then right back to P and of course the chase was on with fresh buy ins and ultra frustration.  DO NOT DO THIS!

[Bally6354]

That's a great shoe to post Al. It's a bit of a humdinger IMO!

I am thinking from hand 26 and the recent B streak, that there is a bit of an indication for the chops, but no!

BB
PPP
BB
PP .... not a biggie if you can handle the 2's.

This is then leading into the P streaks up to hand 43 and again a bit of an indicator for chops and it delivers this time from hands 44 to 51 with 7/8 successful chop wins. Then another little streak on the B's followed by another run of chops. In it's own way, it's consistent (almost on a loop) and as long as you aren't rigid regarding the B's and P's which is a bit of a topical subject at the moment reading about, you can still do well in a shoe like the one above.

[alrelax]

The shoe had everything-so to speak.

You really would have had to be neutral, without favoritism towards much of anything.  And most everyone did not at the table by any means. They lost thousands, bought in for thousands more and lost everything they bought in with. They sat there in astonishment. Classic. Brought the table down I must say. But that is a separate story in its own, emotions-frustrations and little to no camaraderie.

Reference the, "almost on the loop". You are spot on with that statement.

And second, what you said about being, "rigid regarding the Bs and Ps" was also spot on.

The shoe was a great shoe and would have physically drained the dealers rack, if all people playing were in total camaraderie but they were not.

[alrelax]

To myself, I do believe the 3 most important and prevalent events to recognize are:

1)  Equaling Out.  An opportunity for the deficient side to catch up.  Happens more then so many think it does.  This can be anywhere within the shoe. 

2)  One side repetitively pulling 3rd cards which either increases the side to 7-8 or 9 or that same side, repeatedly pulling 3rd cards that reduces themselves to 1-2 or 3 and still beating the opposite side.  Or there might be some 2 card 7s over 6s in there and a natural 9 over a natural 8 as well.  This scenario winds up occurring often into the 8-15 hand range.  Don't get quick to back out if it either, because the opposite side will win a hand or two then right back to the outcome once again for another series of hands.

3)  When it has been numerous 1s, 2s and 3s and then a 4 turned into a 5 or possibly there were one or two 4s, then a 5.  I love that 5 to take off.  (As shown in the example above and many boards I have posted elsewhere on our forum). 

[KungFuBac]

Hi Bally6354
Great to see you are posting again. I've read all your older posts/found alot of value. Hopefully we will hear from you more often.

re: your paragraph in post #17 above:

February 15, 2023, 02:00:10 PM
"...It makes no sense to ignore the Player side, I just don't get that at all. How is someone going to take advantage of the 2's, a long chop or just a good old fashioned dominant P side. Where I play, they mostly follow Bank because there is a Banker bonus which ranges from 2k to about 20k where depending on how many consecutive Bankers you get, a bonus is triggered and then it goes up to a maximum of 12 and you win the jackpot..."

I concur and think many players start playing Bac with that mindset. However, I would like to also think players with a little experience soon realize this is faulty thinking or at least an inferior method of play if one wants to survive the volatility and or take advantage of a strong run on a NonB streak. I guess one could have a degree of success if they choose only one side but one would have to choose a very select spot IMO.

Im not saying B doesn't have the best of it over many thousands of hands(B most certainly is a slightly better deal). However, its the Variance a savvy player should focus on and it does not matter if one selects to wager on P, B, or Opps, or all three.

"...Where I play, they mostly follow Bank because there is a Banker bonus which ranges from 2k to about 20k where depending on how many consecutive Bankers you get, a bonus is triggered and then it goes up to a maximum of 12 and you win the jackpot..."[/color]..."

    With this incentive I guess I could understand ones reasoning in choosing B slightly more often than P. That is an interesting incentive and do not recall ever seeing this.


Continued Success,

[Bally6354]

With this incentive I guess I could understand ones reasoning in choosing B slightly more often than P. That is an interesting incentive and do not recall ever seeing this.


Continued Success,

Hello KungFuBac,

 A lot of the Genting Casinos here in the UK run this promotion, especially the Genting Casinos that are located in the Chinatown area of major Cities like Manchester and Birmingham.
Only a couple of months ago somebody picked up 18k when it reached 12 Banker Hands.

[KungFuBac]

Good comments and discussion everybody.

Hi Bally6354

".Where I play, they mostly follow Bank because there is a Banker bonus which ranges from 2k to about 20k where depending on how many consecutive Bankers you get, a bonus is triggered and then it goes up to a maximum of 12 and you win the jackpot..."..."[/color]

Exactly how is this calculated /paid??(e.g., Is there a scale for B streak length and players place a wager precut on whatever length/for whatever amount they desire, at a predetermined odds payout)??
Let's say X in a row pays 2:1, X+1 in a row pays 3:1, X+2 pays 4:1,...etc.

Other?

Thanks in advance,