Quote from: ll l lll ll l lll on May 03, 2013, 03:17:35 PM
GG,

  Is it neccessary to do the cyclic progression to come out on top long term?

Thanks

For months am preaching the same story.....it is the only way.....but there is more to be said,
but some other time...as am of to Malta this evening.

Quote from: ll l lll ll l lll on May 03, 2013, 03:17:35 PM
GG,

In your experience with this method of play, is playing with flat betting a consistent winner, loser, or break even? (With a proper stop loss)  Is it neccessary to do the cyclic progression to come out on top long term?

Thanks

Completely agree with Flat ino.

Playing flat betting you can be a winner on long term, but your winnings will be something like a 0.01% and you have to have a lot and lot more playing time and larger number of spins to get to that 0.01% coupled with very tight MM. Its not worth it and is no fun. As I mentioned, i figured out the hard way that cyclic progression is the best bet for this kind of a framework. Any other progression that i know will increase your drawdown and hence the risk of losing larger amounts. Hope you get it. Also, as the draw down from cyclic bet is not high as I have shown in the example, there should not be any hindrances playing it and preferring it over flat bet.

Quote from: Atlantis on May 03, 2013, 03:05:13 PM
Hi,
Nice topic, GreatGrampa - or are you RouletteExplorer?? eh?  I say that as you have similar writing style to him and he was an 'oldtimer' too... Anyhow, whatever, I like the idea very much and it's a bit like his "everything reversed system".
Will be trying this soon!
Respect - and please keep up the good work along these lines. 
A.

Glad you liked it. I respect roulette explorer but am not him

I don't mind who u ARE, or who U WERE....your dam good at posting in forums......
but here's the rub of my lack of understanding here.....



(BTW-Thanx for the targeted reply GG....)


How do U equate this then:-

Quote
Of the last two numbers if 2 or 3 out of 3 even chances match its marked as a "W" in the LW register, else it is marked as a L

versus this imponderable?

Quote
14 - REL - L     - +3                         - We won all the 3 bets and got back 6. However as per LW register, this will be marked as "L" even though we won the bet. that's because none of the last even chance repeated. THIS IS KEY. Next bet will be against the chances as the register says L. It will be on BOH.

How come getting 3 outta 3 isn't a Win in anyone's book? lol
The repeat is obviously the issue!

Quote from: GreatGrampa on May 03, 2013, 10:04:49 AM
30 - REH - W   - +1                         - Next bet is REH. Overall we are +2 now.
35 - BOH - L    - -1                          - We bet 3 and got back 2. This is marked as L as per register. So we bet against the chances. Next bet will be REL. Over all we are +1 now.
14 - REL - L     - +3                         - We won all the 3 bets and got back 6. However as per LW register, this will be marked as "L" eventhough we won the bet. that's because none of the last even chance repeated. THIS IS KEY. Next bet will be against the chances as the register says L. It will be on BOH. Overall we are +4 now.
                             

Chris,

Let me try explaining. Lets say you start the table from 2 numbers before the number you had in question.

30 - REH

35 - BOH - L        - No bet. But am marking this as a loss as only one EC matched. The comparison for LW is made between 30 and 35 and not what you bet on. Here you have not bet anything. Because the LW register said L, irrespective of what you bet on, you bet next for the even chances on 35 to fail. For 35 to fail you have to bet on REL.

14 - REL - L        - For a moment forget that you bet on REL. As previous, make the comparison between 35 and 14. it's a loss, so you mark the LW register as loss and bet for the next number also to be loss on 14. So the next bet selection will be BOH. So basically the LW register here is not whether you lost your previous bet or not. The LW register is how the number in current spin performed against the number in previous spin. So your next bet is based on what you see on the table and not based on what you bet last time. What you bet on and whether you lost or won is immaterial here as we are using a cyclic progression to see whether we won a cycle or lost a cycle.

Let me know whether this clarifies! Alternatively, I would suggest to use the excel to input numbers one by one and see how the next betselection suggestion comes up. You will be able to get it eventually.

I see clearly now the rains have gone............


I think I get U now.........Its not the loss of any of the individual EC's that the comparison, but how the whole Triple shot performed as a group, compared to the spin before.


I will look into the Excel sheet, and watch the numbers dance their dance.

Hi GG . . .

Great Post.  I love playing the EC's.

Kindly check out the attached Excel sheet and see if I am understanding your Register.  If not, advise and I can fix.

This sheet comes with it's own RNG numbers.  If you wish to input your our set of numbers, simple delete Column A or copy it and move it elsewhere.

Then, test it out with whatever progression you like.

Enjoy . . .

Nick

@Nick


Tell me please, how easy is it to move the next bet selections around, without ruining the formulas until they align with the layout on the Casino GUI that I am testing Triple Shooter on?


This is how the table is laid out:-
Low, Even, Red, Black, Odd, High
[attachimg=1]


So, lets say the first betselection is Red, Low Even, I would want to read that, left to right, as L, E, R...its makes for less complication on the chip placement, but I realize that we would have to have a six lane wide Betselection to accomadate this option


L, E, R, B, O, H (all the EC's)
L, E, R
L, E,     B
L,     R,     O
L,         B, O
    E, R,         H
    E,     B,     H
        R,     O, H
            B, O, H

Hi Chris .  .

I am a little busy right now, but I was able to quickly reposition the EC to show Left to Right Betting Order for
the 3 EC's.  I can do it for 6 but not this weekend.

Hope this helps...

Nick

Cheers Nick. 

-

I have a question.

I been thinking about looking into John Patrick's way.
Playing against 9 high reds, using low and black.

That way i can see a reason why you would play more then one even money position.
But i don't understand the reason why you would play all six even money position.

Can it be you try to take advantage out of equilibrium's when you aim for triple position?

Quote from: GreatGrampa on May 03, 2013, 08:56:38 AM

Law of reality suggests that all 3 ECs cannot trend together. Put in other words you will not lose all 3 bets on a streak like 10 reds when betting only colours or 10 odds in a row when betting only EO. Sure you may lose some if 2 out of 3 streak, but you will still be winning on one. that's where we are able to achieve and gain some advantage over playing just one EC, by converting this into a partial percentage play.

I am neither a mathematician nor a statistician, but the one with experience and instincts and this sounds right for me as these three are three individual outcomes independent of each other.

If you're betting all 3 EC's at the same time your variance is going to be 3 times what it would be betting on a single EC, so you should triple the bank you have budgeted for 1 if you're going to bet 3. While all 3 EC's may not trend together very often or for long, it will happen often enough for you to need those extra banks.


But I like your "cyclic" approach. 

Quote from: GreatGrampa on May 03, 2013, 02:50:10 PM
Chris,
The LW register is different from what you are trying to play. LW register is what is happening in the table. Irrespective of what you bet, whether you are winning or losing, LW register just follows the table based on the last two numbers came. Of the last two numbers if 2 or 3 out of 3 even chances match its marked as a "W" in the LW register, else it is marked as a "L".

Now comes what you bet. If the LW register says "L", you just bet the opposite of the number that came last, irrespective of where you placed your bets last. It should not be the opposite of where you last placed your bets. This is why this is different from others because you are followign the table for every single bet and not going with a fixed "Same" and "Opposite". Similarly, if the LW register says "W", you just bet the same chances as the number that came last, irrespective of where you placed your bets last.

Hope you got this. Happy to clarify. 

Now I am not a big fan of excels and bots as it interrupts my creativity at the table, but i know some people enjoy using them. So I have created a little excel which is designed to follow exactly what i described in the framework with a 5 spin cyclic progression. All you need to do is enter your base unit and start entering the spins and the excel will do the rest for you. My advice as always, don't be a system player, the excel will make you a system player. Use it wisely! Happy reading and happy playing folks!

wow, thank you very much
the excel sheet counts zero as LBE so it messes the results a bit but no matter

And I agree with Flat, betting in cycles is a very good way of playing - better than flatbetting or standard progressions

Hello again . . .

To see the power of "cyclic progressions" I redid the sheet with a 5 cycle progression.

If in a loss position after 5 spins then +1.

If in a plus position after 5 spins  then (-1).

This is just one variation of cyclical progressions.

Enjoy . . .

Nick

I did a quick trial on SLC live auto-roulette.
+11units in 21 spins (flatbetting only for now)
A.