Quote from: KingsRoulette on December 13, 2012, 05:04:14 AM
           In reality, all the "reading randomness" concept and "educated guessing" concept is as much a failure as any other random system is.
             

Dude, as I said, music to my ears. If only you were a
casino consultant, it would be the icing on the cake.
If only every casino had your insight and clarity of
vision.. My hats off to you, sir..

Quote from: KingsRoulette on December 13, 2012, 06:23:07 AM
      I think this is failure at your part or your concepts are vague and ambiguous.

You say that like vague and ambiguous is a bad thing..

Quote from: KingsRoulette on December 13, 2012, 06:23:07 AM
       You may take it as a matter of pride but I think this is failure at your part or your concepts are vague and ambiguous.

Kingsroulette, it's a waste of time. They apparently know better than us. Yet will offer no clear cut model to test. Best to leave it.

KR, you seem to like monumental statements. So you should love this one. I'll be dead in a few years. I still enjoy going to the casinos. That charting program that I provided to anyone at this forum is about half way to being my validation of concept. When I turn that version loose I will notify the entire world of its existence. I will also notify everyone of my four favorite Roulette forums where I handed it out on a platter to people that clearly rejected it. Once that happens the proverbial s*** will hit the fan. My computer program will prove that negative outcome casino games can easily be mastered and beaten. You are now and will be then an insignificant contribution to best wisdom and sense of my effort to make things clear.  Go ahead. Warn everyone that will listen to you. See if I care.

Quote from: spike on December 13, 2012, 06:27:40 AM
You say that like vague and ambiguous is a bad thing..

Really! I just helped spend six years being deliberately vague and ambiguous.

Quote from: Gizmotron on December 13, 2012, 06:35:53 AM
Really! I just helped spend six years being deliberately vague and ambiguous.

Like I said, what makes anybody think it's a bad thing.

QuoteYou say that like vague and ambiguous is a bad thing..

No buddy. We expect these traits in so-called experts, because they are self-proclaimed experts.

QuoteGo ahead. Warn everyone that will listen to you. See if I care.

Nobody is caring for your "randomness reading" and "educated guessing" either because they can not be used for any gain in real world.

For those of you that might find anything remotely interesting in this thread, I intend to make educated guessing a mechanical based computer algorithm. When I came up with the list of attributes and characteristics it was easy to see that these could be used by a computer to isolate conditions. Then I upgraded the software to easily accept bets and to display telemetry. All that is left to do is put a layer for global effect and the effectiveness layer. All this can be programmed. And to make it as truthful as possible as a validation of concept, I've built it to use entered spins from any real source. I can't wait to put my brain in a hammock and let the slave do all the work. This should be a real interesting year. I get to write my entire bet selection process into a computer program.

Do that and thewold will see your expertise, if any.

Quote from: KingsRoulette on December 13, 2012, 06:45:50 AM
.We expect these traits in so-called experts, because they are self-proclaimed experts.

"Nothing can perfectly beat a random session but luck."

Translation:

You mean YOU can't beat a random session except thru luck. Please
don't apply what you do to me. You have no idea what I do when I
play roulette.. Thanks in advance.

Quote from: spike on December 12, 2012, 07:52:04 PM
Its like listening to music. Is the last note a trigger for the
future notes? When you listen, do you just hear the last
note? Your brain hears all the notes flowing together and
makes sense of them. The past notes make music what it
is, the past outcomes make roulette what it is. I don't see
any triggers, all I see is the flowing and changing of random
and from that I make educated guesses.

Well, yes, in a way the last note IS a trigger for the future notes. I sort of get the analogy and understand that you can look at past spins and see the "gestalt", as it were, but it's still a trigger in the sense that you need those past spins in order to make your best guess.

There's nothing wrong with vagueness and ambiguity per se, but it would be a problem (according to the rules of this forum) if you made big claims for a method described in those terms - which admittedly you haven't done, although both you & Gizmo imply that reading randomness/educated guessing is far superior to any mechanical system.

That's why I think it's a bit rich for you (both) to be on JL's case. He admits to hyping his systems, but IMO that's just his personality and it doesn't mean he's a scammer or has shills (where is the evidence for this?). He has given us something concrete which can be tested AND he's actually trying to show us that it's not all hot air.

Quote from: Gizmotron on December 13, 2012, 07:05:30 AM
For those of you that might find anything remotely interesting in this thread, I intend to make educated guessing a mechanical based computer algorithm. When I came up with the list of attributes and characteristics it was easy to see that these could be used by a computer to isolate conditions. Then I upgraded the software to easily accept bets and to display telemetry. All that is left to do is put a layer for global effect and the effectiveness layer. All this can be programmed. And to make it as truthful as possible as a validation of concept, I've built it to use entered spins from any real source. I can't wait to put my brain in a hammock and let the slave do all the work. This should be a real interesting year. I get to write my entire bet selection process into a computer program.

Gizmo, good for you.  I have the same intention but keep putting it off because it's a daunting task. I'm not unsympathetic to the idea of educated guessing/reading randomness because I use a certain amount of intuition in my bet selections. But unlike Spike, I don't entirely agree that it can't be taught, or more specifically, programmed. FAR more complex "systems" have been successfully coded, models for weather prediction, for example.

Spike may verywell be right. I've done everything I can think of to teach this. There's only one thing that I haven't done. I have not done a step by step explanation of each bet, as it occurs. That is also a tedious use of my time. There might be two or three people here really interested. Anyone that learns this must bring their own acquired experiences to the process. There is no other way. All the computer program is going to do is start the mad scramble. It will be like opening a gate. The yes sign will go on. After the madness the story of how it was discussed openly for years will come out. That will be real interesting.

Quote from: Bayes on December 13, 2012, 09:54:48 AM
Gizmo, good for you.  I have the same intention but keep putting it off because it's a daunting task. I'm not unsympathetic to the idea of educated guessing/reading randomness because I use a certain amount of intuition in my bet selections. But unlike Spike, I don't entirely agree that it can't be taught, or more specifically, programmed. FAR more complex "systems" have been successfully coded, models for weather prediction, for example.

Hello Gizmotron,


This really sounds amazing!


Will your computer program be available in the new year?


Will it indicate when to place a bet or will it be able to place bets automatically?


Please give a heads up when it is ready.


Thanks

It will not operate as an online bot. It will show the next bets that it selects before the next spin is entered. It also runs in practice mode with a fair internal RNG based on the real layout of either the American Wheel or the European Wheel. I might put it out there where it will only run for one day. If it works I might hire an agent to sell it to several millionaires and billionaires. If you ever get your hands on it you will be just one of a throng stampeding towards the doors of every casino on planet earth. Just for the record. Its all there in my attacking trends thread. I will still answer questions. The human brain is for more powerful than a computer that only gets to make choices from the smaller list of possibilities. The task of pattern recognition is going to be difficult. Do I teach the computer to recognize any pattern or just a limited list of possibilities? This is going to be an interesting winter. I'm going to share customized functions that I create. Some here will find it interesting. I prefer my 4th generation language that looks like commentary and yet still compiles as a stand alone application. Even though it probably won't be a scripting language or a third gen language like C++,