Seeing your passion on this forum I will go buy your book on Kindle. It will be my 5th purchase of a baccarat related book from Amazon. 🙄🙄  I have also bought 2 systems from Silverthorne and was also in a discussion with Elliot, the man himself the inventor of NOR, MvD etc etc.

I am of the considered opinion ( as also expressed by some on this forum more eloquently) that each system can only work in certain shoe type.  that's why I think Elliot has come up with so many systems and one has to go search for certain shoe types and apply different systems.

Effectively, it is play the trend as it reveals itself. And stay away during the random phase. If the shoe is showing rows of terrible 2s and 3s which normally kills most systems why must one be an unintelligent and bet against it as proposed by most systems that cannot defeat terrible 2s.l? In my early days  on this forum,  I bought a system, mastered it and went on a cruise ship with my junket. I quickly lost my credit following the system as I came up against several shoes in a row with distinct patterns of terrible 2s. The junket assistants looked at me in despair and at the end of the cruise asked me why She played so differently because the old Lungyeh would have made a killing from the distinct patterns.  Sigh! Life and all its wonders

Quote from: Lungyeh on June 23, 2017, 02:54:48 AM
If the shoe is showing rows of terrible 2s and 3s which normally kills most systems why must one be an unintelligent and bet against it as proposed by most systems that cannot defeat terrible 2s.l? In my early days  on this forum,  I bought a system, mastered it and went on a cruise ship with my junket. I quickly lost my credit following the system as I came up against several shoes in a row with distinct patterns of terrible 2s. The junket assistants looked at me in despair and at the end of the cruise asked me why She played so differently because the old Lungyeh would have made a killing from the distinct patterns.  Sigh! Life and all its wonders

Build your system around terrible 2s.     Use it as building block.

With the clarification from Stephen in the message and on this forum I redid the test and got a better result. The first 27 shoes are the same as the first test.

[attachimg=1]

Thanks
Baelog

Baelog can you send me a PM and explain how you play step by step, i have the book second edition and talk to Stephen about the new additional betting pattern.
But i am honest and can not get past that i am maybe up +25 units in the beginning and after that i hovering around even or encounter small loses.

I thinking to wait with more testing until third edition comes out.

Cheers

Quote from: Sputnik on June 23, 2017, 04:34:11 PM
Baelog can you send me a PM and explain how you play step by step, i have the book second edition and talk to Stephen about the new additional betting pattern.
But i am honest and can not get past that i am maybe up +25 units in the beginning and after that i hovering around even or encounter small loses.

I thinking to wait with more testing until third edition comes out.

Cheers

Hi Sputnik,

I will make a play by play explanation this weekend and PM it to you. I am stuck at work.

Baelog

Hi Baelog I too have the Kindle 2nd edition and Stephen sent me a PM yesterday for clarification but I want to make sure I I understand everything correctly. Can you please send me the same  PM  as well?

Thank you and have a good weekend.

Quote from: Smoothie on June 23, 2017, 07:40:24 PM
Hi Baelog I too have the Kindle 2nd edition and Stephen sent me a PM yesterday for clarification but I want to make sure I I understand everything correctly. Can you please send me the same  PM  as well?

Thank you and have a good weekend.

Hi, I sent you a PM to clarify

Quote from: Sputnik on June 23, 2017, 04:34:11 PM
Baelog can you send me a PM and explain how you play step by step, i have the book second edition and talk to Stephen about the new additional betting pattern.
But i am honest and can not get past that i am maybe up +25 units in the beginning and after that i hovering around even or encounter small loses.

I thinking to wait with more testing until third edition comes out.

Cheers

Hi, Sputnik, I sent you a PM

Quote from: ADulay on June 22, 2017, 06:56:32 PM
Stephen,

  I WILL run the latest iteration of TUBS on any of the shoes that get posted by Alrelax as you seem to believe that my shoe history is suspect for some reason.  At least this way we'll have a valid, current live shoe to work with from time to time and as several of us have the system play in hand, we will be able to see if there are any problems between us.

  AD

As promised here are the three shoes that Alrelax posted late yesterday with the results running "TUBS with mod" and using VDW as the control reference.

Shoe 1:
TUBS -3 with an early stop due to the rules.  It went +0 if run to the end of the shoe.
VDW +5 at hand 53 and at the end.

Shoe 2:
TUBS -4 with an early stop due to the rules.   It went -10 if run to the end of the shoe.
VDW +3 to the end of shoe.

Shoe 3:
TUBS -6 with an early stop due to the rules.   It went +0 to the end.
VDW was -2 mainly due to the unusually high number of "twos" in the shoe.   

Hope this helps somebody.

AD (You guys DID test these shoes, right?)

             

Quote from: ADulay on June 23, 2017, 09:16:49 PM

"At least this way we'll have a valid, current live shoe to work with.."

Valid? To be honest I believe only individual people can say if their own results are "valid" because no one can confirm with the shoe results are genuine and with all respect to anyone posting such results, even if they are genuine there will always be that element of doubt in the readers mind. Therefore it would be better for individuals to carry out there own checks.

I would just like to clarify and explain something about me defending my strategy. I have received PMs and emails from a number of members and readers of this forum (I'm not going to expose any names) stating that there are some members who are supporting a certain expensive workshop system and that the presence of my strategy is not welcome. People are telling me that there are efforts to make my strategy appear not to work. I do not know if this is true or not but I wanted to let everyone know that I am receiving this advise. I did not want to believe them but when I started reading posting telling me not to "fight" etc, I started to have second thoughts. I stared to feel 'warned off'

Quote from: ADulay on June 23, 2017, 09:16:49 PM
As promised here are the three shoes that Alrelax posted late yesterday with the results running "TUBS with mod" and using VDW as the control reference.

Shoe 1:
TUBS -3 with an early stop due to the rules.  It went +0 if run to the end of the shoe.
VDW +5 at hand 53 and at the end.

Shoe 2:
TUBS -4 with an early stop due to the rules.   It went -10 if run to the end of the shoe.
VDW +3 to the end of shoe.

Shoe 3:
TUBS -6 with an early stop due to the rules.   It went +0 to the end.
VDW was -2 mainly due to the unusually high number of "twos" in the shoe.   

Hope this helps somebody.

AD (You guys DID test these shoes, right?)

           

How do we know if these shoes results are even genuine? One minute “Alrelax” is attacking Stephen trying to silence him, the next minute his posting ugly shoes results!!! I smell a rat. From what I could read he never even bought a copy of the book! And suddenly he says the system does not work!!! It seems he’ll do/say anything to attack Stephen and his book, even if that means posting end results of shoes no one can see, or verify as being true and real. And even if they are real he could have selected the worst ones out of many. I mean if this were a court it would be a kangaroo court.

Quote from: Stephen Tabone on June 23, 2017, 07:59:05 PM
Hi, I sent you a PM to clarify

Hi Stephen I got your PM and everything is clear now. Baelog please disregard my previous request.

Thank you Stephen! Looking forward to the 3rd edition.

Griff.

Quote from: Stephen Tabone on June 23, 2017, 10:06:56 PM
I would just like to clarify and explain something about me defending my strategy. I have received PMs and emails from a number of members and readers of this forum (I'm not going to expose any names) stating that there are some members who are supporting a certain expensive workshop system and that the presence of my strategy is not welcome. People are telling me that there are efforts to make my strategy appear not to work. I do not know if this is true or not but I wanted to let everyone know that I am receiving this advise. I did not want to believe them but when I started reading posting telling me not to "fight" etc, I started to have second thoughts. I stared to feel 'warned off'

I agree Stephen, one minute they say it works and then there are some who do not like you because they support the $700 workshop so they are discrediting your system because your book is cheap compared to that $700 a workshop that people have lost money on. And so they are attacking you by posting fake shoe results. There must be a gang of them working to run you and people like you down so as to support the $700 workshop.

Quote from: Smoothie on June 23, 2017, 10:33:39 PM
Hi Stephen I got your PM and everything is clear now. Baelog please disregard my previous request.

Thank you Stephen! Looking forward to the 3rd edition.

Griff.

okay great