Quote from: albalaha on January 07, 2013, 06:44:32 AM
I appreciate your spirit JL but you are mature enough to stop these debates. Better concentrate your energy and experience to come up with better methods.

My talkings done Al, I've already got the methods. The results will show what they can do from here.

Quote from: albalaha on January 07, 2013, 04:21:50 AM
Hey JL,
             Please do not take my words otherwise but you should stop making claims relating to July. It is getting irritating and funny at times.
You may win a million with PB till July while other may still lose big with it. There is nothing eternal in PB that can shake the gambling world. It is just a trial and error and only as good as any other method. I believe in tests and not in words and I am afraid that tests say absolutely opposite of your claims.
               You are doing well with your methods and contributing very well in your own capacity. I deeply appreciate that. For haven's sake stop all these.

Albalaha, im not talking just about PB. Its the weakest of my methods. But for a mere 7 unit buy in. It was never meant to be supernova proof.

You don't put all your eggs in one basket. I use up to 6 methods to make my money. Im not doing this to prove anything other than I CAN WIN.

Spike will be talking me down forever. But what exactly has he proven?

The time for talking success is long over. You have to show it, prove it now. 10% of whatever I make from my chalenge will be donated to this forum. Victor will be very happy about that in the longrun.

Quote from: Gizmotron on January 06, 2013, 08:24:16 PM
You have an uncanny gift for stating the obvious.

You just put JULY 19TH in your diary. That's the date you and all the other naysayers learn what I've known to be obvious for some time.

Quote from: Gizmotron on January 06, 2013, 08:16:10 PM
JL -" And the general belief is it has something to do with the layout."

Spooky. I had no idea there was a general belief or consensus regarding your claims.

We are talking about the even chances in relation to results garnered for PB Giz nothing else.

Quote from: spike on January 06, 2013, 07:32:48 PM
I don't know any other way to talk to you. If I said
what I think of you and your methods, I would be
banned permanently. I have zero respect for you
and the blather you spew.

Of course you said H/L are different than R/B and O/E,
we even had a discussion about it. You can't change
what you said in the past just by waving your hand.
Magical thinking doesn't work in reality, you know.

MAGICAL THINKING??

You don't know All my methods. And again I never said there was a difference between H/L and O/E.


I SAID THERE WAS A SLIGHT DIFFERENCE IN THE RESULTS. I attained with those two-even chances and RED BLACK. And im not alone in this finding.

And the general belief is it has something to do with the layout.

Do I seek your respect and acceptance? Absolutely not. Even when I've done the impossible you will avoid it. Your ego won't allow you to humble yourself to acknowledge you were wrong. And that's fine.

Easy to attack others who put themselves on the line. But still you offer up nothing of real substance that anyone can test to see if youre capable of what you claim. And that's typical, of people who claim much but will show nothing.

Quote from: spike on January 05, 2013, 11:07:31 PM
8 years. At a game you don't even understand.

Let me give an example. You state over and over that
the outcomes from H/L are somehow different than
those from R/B and O/E. This is patently false and
here's why.

The wheel has 37 pockets. We number them for the
sake of keeping track of them. The pockets don't
know they have numbers. They don't know half of them
are high and half are low, half are red and half are black,
etc.

On an unbiased wheel, which is most wheels, the ball
falls in the pockets randomly, it doesn't play favorites. In
the end, all pockets come up an equal number of times.

Every pocket is a combination of H/L  O/E  R/B. To say H/L
comes up differently than O/E or R/B is a physical impossibility.
Its foolishness to think so. Its even more foolish to state that
its true. Yet you do it all the time and expect a complete
falsehood to be taken as fact because you say so.

If you ever want to be taken seriously, study the game and learn
how it works first. Otherwise you'll just be talking to yourself.

I never said there's a difference between the three even chances. Look at the physics of the game. it's a ball travelling around a numbered wheel. As you said it knows nothing of what its moving around.

NOW! Look at the layout of the wheel. And tell me there's no difference between the layout of HIGH LOW-- ODD EVEN. And that of RED BLACK.

don't ever talk down to me in a condescending manner Spike. I know things about this game that will rewrite the history books when Im done.

Translating those things to more open minds. Is all I will do. You will still be doing plenty of talkng this time next year. But it won't matter then.

Actions speak louder.

Quote from: spike on January 05, 2013, 10:32:39 PM
But why is being taken seriously so important? Who cares?
What difference does it make. You can either win or you can't,
that's the serious part. To so overwhelmingly care what people
on a board think of you seems just a little odd. You seem obsessed
with it and its imbedded in every post you make. You want to be
a roulette authority so badly that you actually beg people to believe
you. All you have is your work, that stands alone and determines
peoples opinion ultimately. Constantly pleading to be taken seriously
is off putting, to say the least.

Its not about pleading, its about proving a game thought of as impossible to overcome in the longterm. Never was, if you apply the right method and right mindset.

I care because I've been making my living from this game for 8 years. Every forum I've ever seen has an underlying feeling of pessimism. People exchange ideas. But deep down very few really believe it can be done.

I set out to show it CAN. So people don't just go through the motions in years to come. They will have a real indisputable example to reference. To look at and say if he did it. I can do it.

That's the long and short of it. And into the bargain many people who would sell their mother before they would ever believe a mechanical system can take this game longterm. Will be put right once and for all.

Quote from: spike on January 05, 2013, 08:27:37 PM
Why is that so important, that anybody take you seriously?
You say things like that constantly, and it undermines everything
you write because the only people who think that way, that they
must be taken seriously, they have to be, are people with huge
inferiority problems. People who believe in themselves and know
what they're doing never make statements about being taken
seriously. They're work speaks for itself, they are never worried
about how they're perceived.

So speaks the man who says he can take this game without ever using a progression.

But proves nothing.

For your work to be taken seriously you must SHOW it working. Not talk down to others and hold on preciously to the
secret of your own claims. So several people have to be put right on what I claim. And what I can do. You included. As you
are one of the prime charactors who called me a charleton.

Nothing will REALLY ever change among the masses with this game. Even if I make a million. The only thing that will
change is people will know I am for real. And what I know and do will be there for those who want it. The rest will carry on
believing whatever they believe.

Quote from: MarignyGrilleau on January 05, 2013, 03:43:06 PM
Like if you could be sure that if you waited for 300 spins you had a "sure win", you wouldn't do it!

There are no sure wins Marigny. There are bets that are more certain than others. The longer the wait the sooner the change holds true. But it must be played on a RELIABLE bet selection.

If every player had the right method and amazing patience. At worst the casinos would have a much smaller profit margin. If as ralph says you ran a bot to wait days for an even chance to run off 18 in a row. You are likey to win in the next ten spins. But not certain. But who can wait that long to start their campaign? Very few.

If however you had a bet selection that could give you a similar or even stronger feeling of certainty inside a hundred spins. You get excited. That's where my enthusiasm comes from. But I must prove it with hard cash.

Then more will have a natural inclination to take what I say seriously. And put what they think is black and white about this game on the shelf for a while. Maybe forever if theyve got the right stuff.

Quote from: sqzbox on January 05, 2013, 01:20:14 PM
OK JL - I believe I understand you. 


Some years ago a chap wrote a treatise (some called it a book) called Roulette 2000.  He was (is?) a statistician.  It was his belief that if you waited for an event, and he had a bunch of them enumerated, and then bet accordingly you would hardly ever lose.  For example, if the event of 20 reds in a row constituted a rare event then his belief was that if you had a MM scheme that could handle 6 fails before a win, for example a simple 7 step marty, then you had a winner strategy if you waited until you saw 15 reds in a row - this would guarantee a winner until 22.  Obviously this particular event was pretty rare and you would be waiting forever (effectively) for it to appear, but he had a whole bunch of them to look out for and so he usually didn't have to wait too long before an opportunity of one kind or another came up. Well, long story short, he played seriously for a while and had several really close calls, ended up about even, paid back his bankers and gave up. 


I was one of his bankrollers so I know the story to be true - although I might have one or two details wrong because it is over 10 years ago now.  But nevertheless, for me it was a watershed moment.  It caused me to re-examine a lot of my beliefs and also to bring me back to the maths in a very solid way.  I no longer believe this approach to be valid. I have faith in the maths and I do believe that a mathematical advantage is required for long term success.

However, that is just my belief.  I fully respect your right to believe otherwise and my mind is not closed to the idea if you can, as you say you intend to do, prove it.

Getting back to the thread topic, would you say that your bet selection method constitutes an efficient bet? What is it about that bet that differentiates it from an inefficient bet?

RELIABILITY Bryan. Gambling is by definition risk taking. Doing something with no certainty of success.
What the methods I speak of with VIRTUAL LIMITS do, is take away alot of the uncertainty. They have identified something random struggles to do efficiently. And they simply exploit that.

Nothing more or less. To answer your awakening to the idea that maths explains all. Through your given example of the guy betting against 20 reds. 1, that was no VIRTUAL LIMIT to begin with.

And 2, the time invested wasn't justified. I have never even waited 100 spins to get a game with the methods I use. One of them often matures inside 20 spins.

That is the WHOLE POINT to find realistic and playable VIRTUAL LIMITS. Not ones that take ages to mature.

Quote from: sqzbox on January 05, 2013, 09:50:50 AM
@JL - Ok, so you are saying, categorically as far as I can tell, that money management combined with bet selection, even if that bet selection does not provide an advantage, allows for profitable play long term.  Do I have that right?

I am saying there doesn't have to be an on paper mathematical advantage. For example you bet red 10 times. Flat betting you need to win at least 6 times to profit.

I am saying you need to identify either a point random doesn't fall below the vast majority of the time. Or a point it doesn't go BEYOND. Then you tailor your MM to take advantage of these observations.

That's how I win at this game. Once you have that knowledge, you will always win overall. This I will prove.

Quote from: sqzbox on January 05, 2013, 12:20:53 AM
OK - this is where I have a little trouble - short term vs. long term.  There are 2 problems.
1. These are both relative terms. Is the long term 3.25 million? or infinity? or 300 spins non-stop? Is the short term 5 spins? 50 spins?
2. Is not the long term just the sum of x short terms?  If we say that the answer is yes for the short term, then are we saying that this is an average over a bunch of short terms?  In which case, would not a statistically significant collection of short term sessions sum to the positive?


You see the dilemma I am sure.  I am leaning towards the belief that it is NECESSARY to solve the problem for the long term.  Saying that something (a strategy) works for the short term is just smoke on the water.  dah-dah-daaaah ... dah-dah-dedaaah. 

The trick is to make profit. Too much time is wasted debating longterm Vs short term play. You must understand the game begins and ends from the time you enter the cycle to the time you leave.

what you are able to achieve within that timeframe is all that matters. You can try to be too clever about it all. And the reason is sheep mentality. You hear from so called experts that you don't stand a chance.

Who are you/we to question them? They must know best math is on their side right?

I have never doubted. That played straight you can't win, never ever. BUT WHO SAID YOU HAVE TO PLAY STRAIGHT?

If I say I have a double dozen/column method that wins 4 times out of 8 nearly all the time. The first thing most will say is wait a minute. You are losing 8 and winning 4 how can that work?

Their thinking is so stuck in I lay 5, then I expect at least 6 back. And you wonder why the masses still think this games for fools after 300 years.

To put it simply. smart money management is the most important thing, AFTER you have found a way to make it work. There needs to be no edge. Just a simple understanding, that if I bet this amount at a certain time I will gain a profit.

Not the flawed thinking that I've got to have an edge or I can't win. That flawed notion has guaranteed casinos that the masses always keep the losing habit. And their vaults full.

Quote from: Bally6354 on January 04, 2013, 05:21:29 PM

I tell my story on every gambling forum I go on! So you probably have! 

I wouldn't worry too much JL. There are plenty of casinos out there. The one thing that strikes me reading a lot of books is the real pros work in teams. A one man outfit could certainly outstay his welcome if he got TOO greedy!

Lol! The way youre going Bally that could well be your story. don't downplay what you are doing.

I don't know. there are people out there winning at this game. Its another myth that there are no professional roulette players. As far as im concerned this game is easier to beat than black jack. Card counting or not.

The secret is to not be too greedy. take a little from several sources. You look like a nothing compared to the ones winning hundreds even thousands on mostly luck. But you get your living and no ones the wiser.

I've never been greedy. This is an experiment to find out the breaking point of the most tolerant online casino on the planet. How much will be too much?

I had a feeling of deja vu reading this tale. Im sure I've read it somewhere before. You have to be clever to stay under the radar. With what I know I could destroy any casino. I can't do that online or im cut out. I can and will do it on Supermans account. For the purposes of demonstrating that I can thoroughly beat random longterm with my methods.

there's only two possible outcomes from this challenge. They stop me, or Superman and me both become millionaires in the next 2--3 years. Im certain what comes first.

Quote from: Robeenhuut on January 04, 2013, 07:57:57 AM
Atlantis in his last sample in  50 games had 9 times 11 or more L and once won on the last 10th step. How about these stats?
What happens here is a classic reversed engineering by trying to back fit progression to the stats. If he played here for example 8 step progression after 2L trigger the results would be disastrous. So lets make 16L a virtual limit. How did you come up with this number? 

How is Atlantis playing Matt? If you want to make a comparison with my numbers, you do so with someone playing exactly as im playing.