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Offline Carlitos

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Re: Swiss Dreams
« Reply #15 on: December 02, 2015, 03:57:27 pm »
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  • No problem XXVV. My focus is also somewhere else then the CWB. Been there, done that. Closest that i can find to an CWB is like i say, count all the EC withinn 6 spins.

    Off course there are better ways to invest money, still some of them reminds one also like gambling. However, perhaps better to read them out and influence it.

    1 lesson that can be learned from all of this is always to watch out when sending or buying gambling systems. Off course i understand sometimes people are desperate, which is the weak point.

    Never buy or send money which you can not effort or takes too much of your budget.


    Carlitos  8)


    Offline XXVV

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    Re: Swiss Dreams
    « Reply #16 on: December 02, 2015, 07:59:09 pm »
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  • No problem XXVV. My focus is also somewhere else then the CWB. Been there, done that. Closest that i can find to an CWB is like i say, count all the EC withinn 6 spins.

    Off course there are better ways to invest money, still some of them reminds one also like gambling.


    Carlitos  8)

    Thanks - will be looking at EC bets in particular and your suggested analysis within a moving frame of 6 spins.

    Variance is risk and risk is variance. We seek to reduce variance in every way. There are over 8 types of risk/ variance and in the financial markets there are steps/ filters/ procedures/ strategies unavailable in the casino, and as I say there is something essentially sad about casino life. They prosper through the misfortune and weakness of others and amplify this in their showy often bad taste environments.

    Gambling by definition involves wagering with high volatility and fewer checks/ balances/ controls/ stops thus often resulting in loss. As you know it is documented that some 90% of patrons at a casino are ahead before eventually leaving with a loss. There is an implicit expectation of loss in a casino environment. I know regular patrons who are skilled at roulette who go there 'expecting to lose', which makes the occasional win so rewarding and a surprise.

    Not so with the spirit of commerce which is a very positive and sophisticated human market interchange and this can become an art form when polished and well presented.

    Nevertheless I look forward to a short visit to my casino on the weekend. In order to prosper there it is necessary to be really alert and on guard, and really well resourced and prepared. The old saying - do not play there unless with funds you can afford to lose. As it is the holiday season and we connect with so many others at this time, perhaps the best time to stay away.

    Take care everyone.

    Offline XXVV

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    Re: Swiss Dreams
    « Reply #17 on: December 10, 2015, 09:22:46 am »
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  • Yes we will revisit the PPPC Bet after Christmas. What a treat. Recall that post by Simon that showed the recent session at Wiesbaden where the bet was applied, and the resulting excellent net result.

    It did not take very long for several to work out the bet, and the published data raised a storm of outrage with the author, Arvis, writing to me saying he would never publish on roulette forums ever again as he had received such abuse.

    So after a few years quiet review, where does all this sit now. At the end of the month I will publish some results and applications to handle the particularly slippery nature of EC bets in roulette.

    How can we handle/ mitigate/ restrict/ manage variance?  This is the key, and some of the ideas have been adapted and cross pollinated from management of risk/ variance in the financial markets. So these are strategies for 2016 in the professional game.

    Offline XXVV

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    Re: Swiss Dreams
    « Reply #18 on: December 15, 2015, 06:40:58 pm »
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  • Of course you do realize I speak about CEH and Simon, tongue in cheek, don't you?   The Swiss scam served multiple purposes, and continues to do so in regard to some of the ideas and conversations of that time., especially when related to a fresh context. I find it amusing and rewarding to revisit this material from 5 years ago. CEH and Simon are such comic fiction caricatures. That is why I term this thread Swiss Dreams.

    Offline Carlitos

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    Re: Swiss Dreams
    « Reply #19 on: December 15, 2015, 07:14:39 pm »
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  • Off course Legion 20 Valerie Victrix...., however there are some persons who belief that other persons realy believe in CEH and Simon.

    As if we were......lol......

    I was there from the beginning when the thread started about W3M years ago. It was on, if i rememberd well, VLS first roulette forum or either the VIP forum. It was started by K2.

    If anything good came out of this all it must be " The Edge ", and i do not mean the gitarist The Edge....i just mention this because you never know, some persons might believe that "The Edge " realy exist......lol.....


    Carlitos  8)

    Offline XXVV

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    Re: Swiss Dreams
    « Reply #20 on: December 15, 2015, 07:54:30 pm »
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  • Off course Legion 20 Valerie Victrix...., however there are some persons who belief that other persons realy believe in CEH and Simon.

    As if we were......lol......

    I was there from the beginning when the thread started about W3M years ago. It was on, if i rememberd well, VLS first roulette forum or either the VIP forum. It was started by K2.

    If anything good came out of this all it must be " The Edge ", and i do not mean the gitarist The Edge....i just mention this because you never know, some persons might believe that "The Edge " realy exist......lol.....


    Carlitos  8)

    Yes well done Carlitos !

    That "Edge Bet"  mmmmm.....

    I mentioned yesterday in my other thread that almost certainly no 'bet', per se, will solve your quest in roulette or baccarat.

    The answer lies in market speak 'drilling down' and using the metaphor of a bet within a bet, it is more about investigating ways to first find a way to gain a real positive edge range ( always a range/ band because Ecart swings/ moves like the tide) through empirical live data tests.

    Once you have the proven data and the selection of window of time and opportunity/location, then you construct your bet.

    My preferred way is cluster analysis of elements below the surface of outflowing spin sequences, and thus it is essential to see the living continuity of spin sequences in short to medium cycles in this method.

    There are other ways based on medium to longer cycles of spin outcomes, and possibly also others relating to wheel layout realtionships and table layout relationships.

    In these inside table numbers, or groups of numbers are used, and this is what CEH referred to.

    I personally find the outside table bets much more difficult or slippery but I think if you refer to the work of Gizmotron in roulette/ baccarat, he has ways of reading states/modes,  trends and patterns while yet dealing with fewer variables than what I use which is minimum four. I use cluster analysis working in short cycle 'pairs'.

    The 'Pairs' phenomena referred to by Simon is a bet within a bet, has no relation to my bet,  and as usual appears to end in a fruitless cul-de-sac of binomial threads with no net gain or progress, but I will re-visit more fully in January.

    I have a new idea for professional game strategy which is the Big Bet.. This involves fast high value unit play when all the signs are green
    to indicate a very likely win, say at least 2 out of 4 set criteria give the signal to attack - sometimes more rarely you can get 3 out of 4 are green signals. Then you strike hard and fast then get out and take profit.

    I will write more fully on this soon.

    Merry Christmas

    Offline RLOGIC

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    Re: Swiss Dreams
    « Reply #21 on: December 18, 2015, 03:37:28 pm »
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  • Carlitos and XXVV, would you please help with the following idea?

     Regarding the roulette table layout:

    1. What is the best bet selection that we can use to trap Runs and Changes in Columns if we were to bet on one column or two columns of the 3 columns available on the roulette table layout?
    2. What is the best bet selection that we can use to trap Runs and Changes in Dozens if we were to bet on one dozen or two dozens of the 3 dozens available on the roulette table layout?

    I would like to thank both of you in advance for your replies and opinions and I wish you both a Merry Christmas.



    Offline Carlitos

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    Re: Swiss Dreams
    « Reply #22 on: December 18, 2015, 05:47:54 pm »
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  • ....sorry, iam not into dozen and columns. I simple do not like them.... merry christmas :-)


    Carlitos

    Offline RLOGIC

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    Re: Swiss Dreams
    « Reply #23 on: December 18, 2015, 06:31:31 pm »
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  • Thanks Carlitos for the reply !

    I asked about columns and dozens because you mentioned in your post # 6 the following:

    "what was being tried to be indicated here, was the Edge and the fact that CEH mentioned to look for something with an ratio of 3 to 1"

    In my opinion you are doing an excellent research in order to create a good bet selection, betting formula, and money management by studying the different characteristics, variables and movements of the 3 Even Chances.

    However the payout on each of the 3 Even Chances is 1:1 and their different variables, combinations and movements are plenty and chaotic.

    While the payout on each of the 3 columns / dozens is 2:1 and perhaps their different variables, combinations and movements are less and easier to spot and track.

    That is why I mentioned the Columns and Dozens.




    Offline Carlitos

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    Re: Swiss Dreams
    « Reply #24 on: December 18, 2015, 07:30:39 pm »
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    For what I understand (I might be wrong though) an EC chance bet in a bet that makes you win like for Tasha 70+/100 bets,It's like if I'm betting with certain combinations that have a 70%/75% probability to happen against an equal number of other combinations..As a pure example only, three spins of roulette for an EC can give 8 different combinations,two with the same chance and 6 with the two chances mixed..that's a ratio of 3 to 1 which is equal 75/25. I'm stuck with that right now cause anything else to me looks like guessing otherwise..   


    ...that was ment by ratio of 3 to 1. The quote was taken from the w3m message board.


    Carlitos  8)


    Offline RLOGIC

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    Re: Swiss Dreams
    « Reply #25 on: December 18, 2015, 10:58:52 pm »
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  • Thanks for the explanation Carlitos.

    Do you have a copy of Tasha's Post?

    If you have a copy of Tasha's post, maybe we can compare Tasha's post with Simon's explanation of "a bet within a bet" that was available on page 30 of their website, in order to understand more specifically how they used the "bet within a bet" strategy.

    From the archive of their website that is available on archive.org, Simon has written on page 30 the following:

    Quote
    As a pure EXAMPLE ONLY let us take a 50/50 bet like the penultimate which is fairly stable in the results as IF…you where betting it (NOTE IF !)  Taking the results ( Wins & Losses) as IF you where betting it, you may SEE that for INSTANCE….perhaps after three losses, IF you bet you THEN …..you would win say seven out of every ten.  IF that was a FACT ? You would then have a consistent winner you could use to make a great deal of money… THAT IS AN EXAMPLE OF A " BET WITHIN A BET"

    Thank you very much Carlitos.

    Offline XXVV

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    Re: Swiss Dreams
    « Reply #26 on: December 19, 2015, 05:50:19 am »
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  • Thanks for the explanation Carlitos.

    Do you have a copy of Tasha's Post?

    If you have a copy of Tasha's post, maybe we can compare Tasha's post with Simon's explanation of "a bet within a bet" that was available on page 30 of their website, in order to understand more specifically how they used the "bet within a bet" strategy.

    From the archive of their website that is available on archive.org, Simon has written on page 30 the following:

    Thank you very much Carlitos.


    Hello RLogic

    It is XXVV here. I am in Sydney at the moment and will not be back in my office till Dec26.

    I will endeavour to research and answer your very interesting enquiries after that.

    Merry Christmas
    R

    Offline Carlitos

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    Re: Swiss Dreams
    « Reply #27 on: December 19, 2015, 08:06:08 am »
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  • Tasha, CEH, Simon etc... its assumed they are all the same persons... all the quote's came from the message board which was used on the w3m website. No one could post there freely. I have the most important quote's from the message board. I will post the whole lot....

    In the meantime, it seems that you have been doing some research also....

    XXVV, also has the entire website copied. He can add some more to your questions as he already have said.

    Quote
    The Quest said:   May 7th, 2010 6:00 pm
    @Massimo: Hi dude, indeed SIMON HAMPSHIRE is right. Do not give away your advanced research. That's also true that we have the good intention to help. However, we must stay alert somehow! I have solved problem of converting 25 bad ones into the good ones! Just a clue to you .... those 25 ones will break even!!!! Make your mind work, the answer is too clear. Take a break and come back to your drawing board! :) best of luck!


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    Massimo said:   May 7th, 2010 2:30 pm
    @Mr. Johnson thank you for your reply and your wishes,I appreciate it; I'll definitely look better.. my original idea was to trap both the plus and minus after reading Simon's words,in order to convert that bad 50 (the minus) into a good 25. I didn't mean to take it litterally of course,that was just a lamp that turned on in my brain and I wanted to explore it; now I know that It's the wrong direction. For what I understand (I might be wrong though) an EC chance bet in a bet that makes you win like for Tasha 70+/100 bets,It's like if I'm betting with certain combinations that have a 70%/75% probability to happen against an equal number of other combinations..As a pure example only, three spins of roulette for an EC can give 8 different combinations,two with the same chance and 6 with the two chances mixed..that's a ratio of 3 to 1 which is equal 75/25. I'm stuck with that right now cause anything else to me looks like guessing otherwise..


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    Desperado said:   May 8th, 2010 1:51 pm
    While testing penultimate bet and possible "bet within the bet" I discovered that I was doing something wrong, so here is tip for all of you still working on it: make sure that all the time you take into account results of penultimate betting, even if your previous bets were actually "bet within the bet". Meaning, plan your next bet based on how penultimate "would have" done. I think this is what Simon meant with "IFâ?¦you were betting it (NOTE IF !)" on page 30.


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    Tasha said:   April 29th, 2010 10:18 pm
    Hello everybody, this will be my last post for some time. And its just a reminder for those who are still playing around. OUR BETTING RULES: We play safe at all times. We bet one bet at a time We never place other bets We donâ??t guess We never gamble Have a good time everybody! CIAO


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    Tasha said:   April 25th, 2010 5:51 pm
    Its not so hard to convert that 50 to 25wining ones because losing session tend to loose ONLY with 2 paterns :) the hardest part is to know how to use that 25 to  your advantage. And Compa i will not answer your question :( sorry... if u understand odds u will know how many exactly...


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    The Quest said:   April 25th, 2010 4:53 pm
    Hi all, Indeed that's the hardest part to convert the losing 50 part into a positive 25 because it is inversely proportional to the winning part. Hmmmmm... Now, the question is, do we additional unit for that? thank you :)


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    MICK said:   April 24th, 2010 11:29 pm
    Just a bit more food for thought , 1) EC , 2/1 and bets of various other odds can be derived from other standard table bets e.g by playing 3 of the 6 line (5/1 bets) or by playing 6 of the 12 street (11/1 bets). These bets are slightly less simple to play than the standard EC and 2/'1 bets.One could even consider playing groups of single numbers or splits but this is moving even further away from a simple bet , but still may be an area to explore and engineer a CWB. My approach to hunting for a CWB is to firstly trial all standard and non standard EC options then 2/1 and so on , working my way out to the higher odds bets. The options one has to trial can be very time consuming , but the options are not infinite in my view, they are limited. Always remember that we are to play both the runs and changes, Remember one without the other is a recipe for disaster. Best to keep records of your trials that can be referred back to at a later date if need be. W3M has previously advised they have identified 6 CWB , there may be more than 6 out there to be found. Could it be reasonable to assume that not all of these 6 CWB are to be found in the standard EC and 2/1 table bets. 2) Charles mentioned in the W3M site that dealers/croupiers often will not pay players correctly on the corner bet (8/1),a sort of brain thing. Could this be another clue or is it an observation and good advice from an experienced player. Regards MICK


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    Tom VH said:   April 24th, 2010 6:30 pm
    This is based on posts of: Tasha and VHM (read them again) because I believe those are leading us in the right direction. Both of them suggested finding a 50/50 bet. Penultimate betting leads to a 50/50 bet (was published on w3m). The next step would be to find a bet within the results that can possibly trap more winners within the odds paid. When u bet the penultimate result of High and Low. U could instead of betting H, choose to bet Dozen 3 and for L bet dozen 1. Why would we do that? Well we know our bet (if we would bet the EC) wins 50% of the time. Betting only on the matching dozen would mean we only win on 12 of the 18 (66,67%) numbers but we would win at a rate of 2to1. Now I have tested it with breakeven results. Iâ??m currently a little stuck in my learning process and would like some feedback from the proâ??s. Iâ??m missing something. How can we convert the losing 50% to a 25/25 without making an odds bet (gonne sleep a night on that one)? as always thanks and kind regards Tom VH.


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    thomas said:   April 24th, 2010 12:21 am
    @tom: a bet within a bet is if you have a bet that is an 50/50 bet it has some factors (reasons) why it is working for this. Now the part is to find out what the special factors are for the 50% that loose and to convert these factors for your advantage. For me this is the hardest part after the fade out of odd thinking. I hope this helps, stay tuned like I do. Natascha is the best example that we all can find it, some need less and some need more time to do it.


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    Tasha said:   April 23rd, 2010 3:27 pm
    Hello guys, how are you doing today? Well im doing GREAT :) i have found the CWB!!! no not the bet but the theory behind the bet :) its simple. I will basicaly help now those who have theyr 50/50 bet, guys remember Charles words : Bet withing the bet, that means u can easy make that bad 50 and make it to 25good ones! My bet wins 75 from 100CONSISTENTLY!!! i don't know if Simon will publish this, maby this is too dangerous, but i simply wanted to tell you this : If Charles can DO IT, I can DO IT, if I CAN DO IT, YOU CAN DO IT!!! don't give up, we are very close


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    Tom VH said:   April 23rd, 2010 11:35 am
    @Tasha said: April 15th, 2010 8:07 pm At last nice to see people looking in to the right direction: "first you develop or engineer a bet that is AT LEAST stable in its Win/Lose RESULTS. AT this stage you look for A Bet" As u can see we need 50/50 bet, that was allready published on this website, then we need to convert that losing 50 into 25/25. If we can do that we have our CWB. Guys lets keep up a good work and we gonna crack it in a matter of weeks!!! Dear Tasha this post of u has been going around in my head since the day you made it. It matches a couple of hints I once got from a very wise man. It was some time ago and I didnâ??t fully understand it back then. I know u are advocating strongly that the bet must be as simple as possible (couldnâ??t agree more). But as I understand it, the strategy u explain consists of 2 parts. The 50/50 bet (which the regular readers should have because it was published on W3M) and the part where we convert the remaining 50 into a 25/25 bet. Donâ??t we at least need a 2 chip bet? U canâ??t make a bet within a bet with only 1 chip, or am I wrong? Kind Regards Tom VH.


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    Invisible Flame said:   April 23rd, 2010 2:14 am
    @Ali, that was beautiful! Thanks for sharing that thought!.............@Gordon, You are studieing the layout. That is good. But you are still thinking about the odds. I am trying to help the best I can without giving away certain ways of thinking. Especially sinse my journey is not complete.... The Doz And Col are both simple bets. If I could say one thing about them, focus on just THEM. Don't narrow your research on bet combinations that trap more winners (ODDS). You can do a lot win one bet at a time with the 2 K's. Look at the fact that the Engineering makes the rest of the bet. Braoden your scope!!!!! YOu will also need to do a great deal of study of clustering and understand the layout so that you can recall instantly where any number is without thinking about it. Know the layout forwards and backwards and more. You can choose to be a pro anytime!!!!


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    Tasha said:   April 21st, 2010 9:51 am
    Indeed some posts are very funny some posts are good, for those who have done some work ill remind that we need to keep it simple to understand the randomness of roulette. And those who are still playing with combinational bets...guys  your still looking at the odds of the game, like the first day i started to read this website


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    Tasha said:   April 20th, 2010 10:56 am
    OK i should open my school here for ppl who haven't read this website properly and have stuck on the ground floor of the building. Equal chances(from 100) tends to win 50% Columns and rows(from 100) 33.3% Its simple mathematics that roulette is based on. Now for those clever dicks who like to think with complexity u can make 2 or 3 or 10 or 20 chips bets and don't understand how it works, or u can keep it simple like me and understand that each bet will win you only percentage that i have written above, it doesn't matter how u will put them, they will still win you the same amount... so i can see that, only by placing simple bet, it will win me 50% of the session(simplicity), u can do it hard way and place 5 or 10 bets and realize same thing :) Charles have the edge, and its all we need to know, and when we will have the edge we can do it with no matter how many bets... the secret its the edge and how to trap it... In other words know how to contain randomness and you will be on your way to the level where i stand...


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    Tasha said:   April 19th, 2010 7:33 pm
    @Robert, what Charles means by 2 units before being in profit is that he loses maximum 2bets in a row before being in profit, and i truly believe that charles bet is a single bet, any other bets 2 or 3 ar getting loses and i have done research on that. And i think its useless to debate about such thing because we all stand on different level, some of us have done more work then others, for me its like getting in to political games where noone is a winner.


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    Robert said:   April 19th, 2010 6:44 pm
    @ Erik. On page 3 under money management it says we only use 2 units of our bank before being in profit. An engineered bet must have a minimum of 2. Any more than that would be a devastating loss if you lost the bet and would be very difficult to recover from. Also on page 15 Charles says to win you have to win 19 out of 37 on even chance bets to win and you have to win 13 out of 37 to win on 3 to 1 bets, columns or dozens. Therefore I conclude that the bet is 2 units, one an even chance bet, and the other either a dozen or a column.


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    paul said:   April 19th, 2010 7:10 am
    There are 2 separate actions: 1. trap the runs 2.trap the changes How could "A BET" that be able to cover these 2 actions. I think 2 chips at 2 places.I don't know.I might be wrong.


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    Zeus said:   April 17th, 2010 1:51 pm
    @Robert, i think you are right, we need 2 bets or better saying a double edged bet that can trap the run and the changes...


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    Tasha said:   April 16th, 2010 2:03 pm
    I think the CWB is FLAT bet, and as far as my research goes (i might be wrong) u can only have CWB with EC or 2to1 bets. If we can concentrate on that only we can achieve something great.


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    Erik said:   April 16th, 2010 4:54 am
    @ Tasha, if we are to keep the bet as simple as possible to take advantage of uncontrolable randomness, then it sounds like you are advocating to play one of the "even" chances. An even chance 50/50 bet in itself is the most simple of all the betting locations on the roulette table.


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    Robert said:   April 16th, 2010 2:57 am
    @Tasha. If I understand correctly, are you suggesting we bet all 3 even chance bets? If we could consistently win on average 2 out of 3, that would be a CWB. I would never have thought of that. Very clever.


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    Tasha said:   April 15th, 2010 8:07 pm
    At last nice to see people looking in to the right direction: "first you develop or engineer a bet that is AT LEAST stable in its Win/Lose RESULTS. AT this stage you look for A Bet" As u can see we need 50/50 bet, that was allready published on this website, then we need to convert that losing 50 into 25/25. If we can do that we have our CWB. Guys lets keep up a good work and we gonna crack it in a matter of weeks!!!
     

    Offline RLOGIC

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    Re: Swiss Dreams
    « Reply #28 on: December 19, 2015, 03:16:21 pm »
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  • Thanks XXVV for the reply.

    Thanks Carlitos for the quotes from the message board.

    Carlitos, you are right I have been doing some research since a couple of months, I have read all related posts on the different forums by searching all related terms on Google and I have read what remains from the archive of the website available on archive.org

    Carlitos and XXVV I like your research methodology, your research is based on knowledge, experience, and the facts that you have gathered.

    I will read many times the message board quotes that you have posted, to deduce what "a bet within a bet" means from the context they published on Page 30 of the website and on that message board, then I will post my opinion about what a "bet within a bet" could possibly mean.

    Again I thank both of you and I wish you both a great holiday.

    Offline XXVV

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    Re: Swiss Dreams
    « Reply #29 on: December 24, 2015, 09:38:50 pm »
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  • Thanks RLogic. Really appreciate your comments, and again I want to thank Carlitos for contributing so much.

    Well I have traveled north and accessed my files that go back from 2008 through 2010, and already have struck some gold. Some of you, or even most may be dismayed, but I propose to reference quite a lot of ideas from various sources and assemble for the new melting pot. Note also I will reference writers from that time and take a fresh look. One of these  Turbo Genius is currently posting on Gambling Forums with erudite views on the lack of worth of triggers, and stops, and any past spin reference. I will be more specific over the next few days but for those who are familiar with my writing and various bets I have discussed in whole or in part, you will note I use all of these phenomena and more, although it would appear TG would agree with the principles behind the WF bet, as he notes to play warm/ hot numbers is more efficient than attempting to catch awakening sleepers. Also I will not post on other forums as there will just result hostile comment that simply causes distress to all. It is unwise to close down your beliefs, and better to keep open as our view of 'reality' can shift. Certainly in the world of roulette context is everything in my view.