He's really nailed it. :applause:
http://www.financial-spread-betting.com/Becoming-a-professional-gambler.html
I like the writing very much.
Thanks.
Cheers
Mike, does he talk about advantage play only or do he talk about all games in general - including system players.
Cheers
Sputnik,
The site is really about financial spread betting, but in some pages he writes about gambling or speculating in general, including casino games, so I suppose that could mean systems too.
QuoteSo we're reduced to being *ugh* gamblers. How depressing.
Actually, not really. This "investor, speculator, gambler" thing is really just an IYOUHE game. I YOU HE. I am creative. YOU are eccentric. HE is an acid-tripping lunatic. See how that works? I am an investor. YOU are a speculator. HE is a gambler. But let's take it down a step further. You get an unhappy feeling when I tell you that you're a gambler. Why? Why is that bad?
What it is, I think, is that a "gambler" is considered to be someone who takes foolish risks without thought, and who is out of control when it comes to money. This is totally wrong. A gambler is just someone who takes risks with money, nothing more. There are a lot of people in Vegas who lose everything they brought to town, even if they went way up before blowing out. There are a lot of people in Vegas who play the various games available without consideration for their chances of success at each one, and without a specific goal in mind. For those who were just there on a vacation, this isn't necessarily a bad thing. For those who went there with the plan or the need to win, this is pretty unfortunate. It's also unfortunate to see folks trading... sorry, betting, and getting into losses way over their head that they hadn't planned on and can't quite afford.
But there are also people who gamble in Vegas who have a risk management plan. They lose small amounts and then stop. They win and pull part of their profits so they make sure they have something to take home. They win for a while, and then stop when the market... sorry, the game starts to move against them. There are also people who gamble successfully for a living. Not too many of them, but they play only specific games with a very specific plan, and treat the entire endeavor (the play, the risk management, the profit management) as a business. It is a business for them; it's the methodical and studied attempt to accumulate income.
In trading, it's the same thing. I went to Vegas once in 1997 (sue me, sitting in smoke filled rooms isn't my thing). I was absolutely blown away at the similarities between playing craps, roulette (heaven help you), slots, etc. and trading. Everybody's got a system, but very few of them are sensible -- at least, very few of them are sensibly and consistently implemented. People talk about luck, about risk and reward, about the huge amount somebody made once, about the big losses somebody had once. Folks win a little, lose a little. Everybody dreams about an absolute killing, and next to nobody gets one. Most folks seem to lose what they came with, but not way more than that. Emotion reigns as king; every sizeable win yields a victory dance and flashing lights, and every long drawdown and big loss produces despair. I played quarter slots. I started with a fixed maximum loss, and as the position increased (it was a Saturday evening, on a machine near but not right at the entrance...) I set a trailing stop onthe amount of money in the machine. I got as high as £475 ahead, but when the trailing stop at £300 got hit, I cashed out. Nice trade; nothing to write home about, but a decent return on quarter slots. Over the next couple of days, I won a little more and then lost steadily. When I got down to £200 ahead on the trip, I stopped and watched everybody else lose money for the duration. Same as being wrong about the same market too often, so you give up and go somewhere else for a while until the market behavior changes.
http://www.financial-spread-betting.com/trading-or-gambling.html
Lots of great info here whatever your game.
Thanks Mike for bringing this comprehensive site to our attention. A mine of information.\R
Life as a gambling Pro seems too broad. How about life as a roulette professional?, that's more like it.
You don't need 500k as a bank, 50k tops. You can binge gamble once a month to make enough to maintain a living. What more do you want?, unless you are an amateur who needs to gamble every chance you can.
Life is good.
The Crow
Quote from: The Crow on February 07, 2015, 04:49:47 PM
Life as a gambling Pro seems too broad. How about life as a roulette professional?, that's more like it.
You don't need 500k as a bank, 50k tops. You can binge gamble once a month to make enough to maintain a living. What more do you want?, unless you are an amateur who needs to gamble every chance you can.
Life is good.
The Crow
yep $50 is about right (maybe a little more depending on what kind of living you want to maintain :nod:)
Life as a pro gambler requires a stock portfolio of $ 600,000.-- , home or Condo ownership without mortgage and a gambling bankroll of $ 50,000.--.
ND
ND have John Patrick wrote about this - i think you once mention it ...
Cheers
Sputnik
,
Quite possible that I did.
ND
Mike thanx for the info
Iggiv,
If ypu are $ 50 short of the $600,000 don`t be discouraged as long as you meet all the other requirements .
ND
Quote from: NathanDetroit on February 07, 2015, 07:54:24 PM
Life as a pro gambler requires a stock portfolio of $ 600,000.-- , home or Condo ownership without mortgage and a gambling bankroll of $ 50,000.--.
ND
5k is nothing ND - but maybe there is a way.
And i don't have 60K in stocks LOL
Lets say you have rent, bills and food for 31 days each mounth 1400 Euro.
You work for a living and pay this amount of money for your needs.
We might also add 200 Euro for fun things to do and clothing, so we end up with 1600 Euro.
Now how are we going to earn that money each mounth.
We can not work and play professional in the same time.
I assume that if We play professional we will spend at least 8 hours each day in casino.
Can be to get action when other pepole are around or getting the right conditions.
Just as regular work.
There is no gurantess, i assume you will have good mounths and bad mounths.
So where is the money comming from and what kind of size do you need for you bankroll.
I would say you need at least 25K one year of income to make one year of income, right ?
I would also say that you need to take advantage of the state/govurment.
In my contry you get 80% of your salary as insurance if you not have work for one year.
After that you get 65% of your salary as insurance if you not have work for as long you want.
But to qualify for this you have to show the insurance company that you search for work each mounth.
You need to apply and write like 20 companys each mounth.
Now you have insurance if your to become professional not succed and during the path or jorney you have insurance with some minium wager from the goverment as uneployed.
I assume that is how some one neeed to do it or make it if they don't have 25K as bankroll.
Then maybe 5K would help some one build a decent bankroll during 2 years period - maybe reach 30 to 40K
I also think as professional you will traveling around and get other expensives, bills.
This is also a very important expect about gambling.
When you working in my contry you get points from the gouverment for your pension.
So when you grow old you get money from the state and can live a peace full life.
But when you not working and gambling you don't get this points or insurance.
Then you get minimum pension from gouverment that is around 600 to 700 Euro.
Now we can assume there is around 700 Euro missing. (if working we would get 1400 E)
And when we grow old we want to have around 1400 Euro or more to get a peace full life as old person.
We might live 30 years more after 65 years old.
That means you need to save money to get a decent life as old and we are not talking about peannuts.
This means that during your gambling carrier you need to play big and win big.
You might grind during bad flucatations and variance when bad weeks hitting you.
But when you play your regular game you need to win serios money.
So can it be done - Yes and No - you need to be clever and use the society to your advantage to get a good start.
If you don't have 60K in stocks and 25K bankroll
Cheers
Sputnik,
that stock portfolio is $ 600,000.00 ( SIX Hundred Thousand Dollars) bringing you about a monthly income of $ 1,250.00.
In additon I would like to mention that here in the USA some of the bonafide professional gamblers have formed their own LLC ( Likmited liability corporation) who are paying taxes on their net earings( winnings .
All on all I go along with the calcularions from your vantage point.
ND
Hi Mike.
Thanks for sharing this post.
Life as a Pro Gambler is possible if you have: 1) the gambling funds, 2) the mental & physical toughness, and 3) a solid system of play.
When I say gambling funds, these are funds solely for your gambling activities. Not money to be paid for bills...food...rent...mortgage...tuition...etc. In this way, the psychological pressure of your daily needs will not distract you from your gambling activities. A bankroll of at least 1,000 units could give you a very good advantage over your chosen casino table game.
Unknown to many, gambling is a very stressful activity both mentally & physically. Have you tried playing 6-8 hours of your favorite casino table game, 5 to 6-times a week, for 1 whole month under a smoking environment?
A solid system of play prolongs your bankroll under the worst possible table conditions. So, when the favorable conditions come, you can easily recover & profit at the same time.
If you satisfy these three requirements, then, you can commend yourself for being the very few who gambles for a living.
Natural 9 ;)
Quote from: Natural 9 on March 17, 2015, 10:22:09 AM
Hi Mike.
Thanks for sharing this post.
Life as a Pro Gambler is possible if you have: 1) the gambling funds, 2) the mental & physical toughness, and 3) a solid system of play.
Yes I have all three.
Quote from: Natural 9 on March 17, 2015, 10:22:09 AMA bankroll of at least 1,000 units could give you a very good advantage over your chosen casino table game.
I have a bankroll of 1000 units but would never risk a 1000 units
Quote from: Natural 9 on March 17, 2015, 10:22:09 AM
Unknown to many, gambling is a very stressful activity both mentally & physically. Have you tried playing 6-8 hours of your favorite casino table game, 5 to 6-times a week, for 1 whole month under a smoking environment?
A solid system of play prolongs your bankroll under the worst possible table conditions. So, when the favorable conditions come, you can easily recover & profit at the same time.
If you satisfy these three requirements, then, you can commend yourself for being the very few who gambles for a living.
Natural 9 ;)
Yes I know all about it. I gamble for a living, yes it can be extremely stressful, yes you have to be very determined, hard nosed and not lose your cool. Yes I play on average 6 days per week and play for as long as it takes to get the job done, I don't have to put up with the smoking though...
There is a distinct difference between the armature and the professional.
"Armatures practice until the get it right. Professionals practice until it cannot go wrong."
Life as a pro,
The Crow
Wow, so the john-o/mr.tilt has mental toughness?????????? I'm laughin so hard I got Guinness comin all out of mouth all over my damned keyboard, hey hey! :applause:
Quote from: soxfan on March 19, 2015, 05:17:59 AM
Wow, so the john-o/mr.tilt has mental toughness?????????? I'm laughin so hard I got Guinness comin all out of mouth all over my damned keyboard, hey hey! :applause:
Pathetic
adolf Fergus, you must be one fat SOB with all that Guinness and those Cashews you consume,
hey hey hey hey hey hey :zzz:
Quote from: The Crow on March 19, 2015, 04:58:30 AM
There is a distinct difference between the armature and the professional.
"Armatures practice until the get it right. Professionals practice until it cannot go wrong."
Life as a pro,
The Crow
Very well said, sir.
Best
Drazen
Crow-do you play full time as a professional?
Hello Whiskeypete,
Yes, if call once a month (three days) professional. I only take what I need, whether it's 4,000.00 or 10,000.00, or more, depends. What is your definition of a roulette professional?
The Crow
I would say someone who can enter a casino on a regular basis and win more than they lose over and over again like yourself
Hi Whiskeypete,
Very clear definition, well said.
It is not easy as it sounds. I practice everyday. One has to be mentally, physically, and emotionally fit become a professional roulette player. Why? Mentally one needs to withstand the trappings of Vegas, alcohol, distractions (beautiful women, constant music, bright lights, mostly noise in general). The other aspect of a hit and run style is you have to be physically fit because one will be walking and moving a lot. Exercise and great eating habits is a must. Emotionally fit comes to play when one comes face to face with a loss. The tendency is to stay and try to recover the loss. One has to be emotionally strong to maintain that urge.
Other things that one needs to be aware of is who is watching you, (paranoid), are you being followed. I say this because I have been rolled twice in my life time, at gun point. Perhaps the most important thing to keep in mind is the psychological warfare of the casino verses the advantage player. It is very difficult to maintain a balance with the casino, especially if you are winning every time. Now, one has to figure out a strategy not to be band.
It has been my experience that anyone who is an expert in roulette is also an expert in other forms of gambling or sports, like poker, billiards, chess, darts, golf, ping pong, to name a few.
It's not easy. "It's a hard way to make easy money."
The Crow
Quote from: The Crow on March 20, 2015, 06:42:20 PM
It has been my experience that anyone who is an expert in roulette is also an expert in other forms of gambling or sports, like poker, billiards, chess, darts, golf, ping pong, to name a few.
It's not easy. "It's a hard way to make easy money."
The Crow
Yeah only takes 10-15 years of real dedication and focused effort to be an overnight success 25 years to really be "around the block"
Quote from: The Crow on March 20, 2015, 06:42:20 PM
I have been rolled twice in my life time, at gun point.
Hi The Crow, I'm interested in this, did you get rolled after a gambling session? Were you clocked in the casino before hand? If so how far away were you from the casino?? Don't say the lobby only j/k...
Hi Rolex-Watch,
The first time happen when I drove into the parking lot. A van rolled up behind my car to block me and a guy came out from the passenger side, wearing a hoodie and shades, brandishing a gun. The time was shorty after midnight. This all happened in a few seconds. I always have two banks, one with a two hundred dollars in twenties, the other 5,000.00. He demanded money and I gave him the decoy wallet, that was that. They drove away. I reported it to the casino. Big mistake. They checked the cameras and I was in a blind spot. What they said to me was that I did not behave like I was robbed because I was not emotional. A normal person would be yelling and stating frantically "I was robbed." I said to them, I was robbed and I don't want this to happen again to someone else. By the way, I am a poker player who has control over my emotions." They did not believe me and began to accuse me of making this story up because I needed an excuse, for my wife, that I lost my money by being robbed instead of losing it at the casino. What? I was coming to the casino, not leaving. I was detained for hours. They used the good cop bad cop strategy on me. I said to them to either file the complaint, arrest me, or let me go about my business. So, they let me go with a warning, if they find out that I lied, they will press charges.
They second time it happened, I had "sold" a pair of Paquiao vs Bradley II tickets at the MGM. I was walking back to the strip and was robbed at gun point, part of the side street was dark. I did not have a wallet or bank, just the 2,000.00 I made from the tickets. Needless to say, I did not report the incident.
Being a lone wolf has it's disadvantages. I currently have a gaming partner, and we are always on alert.
The Crow
Quote from: The Crow on March 21, 2015, 06:11:46 AM
I currently have a gaming partner, and we are always on alert.
The Crow
You should call yourselves Heckle and Jeckle. [smiley]aes/beer.png[/smiley]
Thanks for posting that Crow and I'm sorry to hear it. I was just curious if you were sized up inside a casino, which wasn't the case...
Quote from: The Crow on March 21, 2015, 06:11:46 AM
Hi Rolex-Watch,
The first time happen when I drove into the parking lot. A van rolled up behind my car to block me and a guy came out from the passenger side, wearing a hoodie and shades, brandishing a gun. The time was shorty after midnight. This all happened in a few seconds. I always have two banks, one with a two hundred dollars in twenties, the other 5,000.00. He demanded money and I gave him the decoy wallet, that was that. They drove away. I reported it to the casino. Big mistake. They checked the cameras and I was in a blind spot. What they said to me was that I did not behave like I was robbed because I was not emotional. A normal person would be yelling and stating frantically "I was robbed." I said to them, I was robbed and I don't want this to happen again to someone else. By the way, I am a poker player who has control over my emotions." They did not believe me and began to accuse me of making this story up because I needed an excuse, for my wife, that I lost my money by being robbed instead of losing it at the casino. What? I was coming to the casino, not leaving. I was detained for hours. They used the good cop bad cop strategy on me. I said to them to either file the complaint, arrest me, or let me go about my business. So, they let me go with a warning, if they find out that I lied, they will press charges.
They second time it happened, I had "sold" a pair of Paquiao vs Bradley II tickets at the MGM. I was walking back to the strip and was robbed at gun point, part of the side street was dark. I did not have a wallet or bank, just the 2,000.00 I made from the tickets. Needless to say, I did not report the incident.
Being a lone wolf has it's disadvantages. I currently have a gaming partner, and we are always on alert.
The Crow
Hi The Crow.
Well, maybe next time, avail the VALET SERVICE of casinos. :nod:
I doubt that the valet fee will hurt you because you said 4K to 10K is a walk in the park for you playing roulette. ;)
I liked your concept of a "decoy wallet." I'll tell this to my kids just in case they will get mug. :applause:
Natural 9 :thumbsup:
Hi Natural 9,
In 1993, I worked briefly as a project manager for major parking company, managing several valet services for major hotels and businesses. No way I would valet a car.
I don't drive anymore in Vegas. I have a driver.
Side note: my decoy wallet has a rubber band wrapped around it.
The Crow