This post is me expressing my support for both esoito and ADulay.
Moderation of any forum takes a lot of time and effort all for the reward of NOTHING in real terms.
Thank you both for stepping up and doing a job most of us would not like to have to spend time doing. As you will already know you only get feedback when you step on someone who is out of line and they protest loudly, as has happened here in the last few day. Most don't bother reading the rules, if they did they wouldn't be getting their posts deleted or althered. If they did read the rules and posted anyway they are most likely just trolls trying to disrupt.
Thanks again.
And thank you for those kind words of support and perceptive observations. Greatly appreciated, believe me.
Your last couple of sentences were spot on.
Sadly that's exactly how it is with those that either don't read the Rules, or they simply stick up two fingers at the rest of us as they willfully choose to ignore them!
I'm fast running out of patience with them...
Quote from: esoito on September 18, 2014, 07:30:21 AM
I'm fast running out of patience with them...
Max - It is not an easy task that you are doing. It is a very delicate task to balance personal opinions from moderation. I am no one to comment on your moderation capabilities, but all I can say is it is a very thankless job and you are doing a fantastic job of sticking to what you believe.
A moderated community is a nicer place to be. There were questions raised on freedom of speech etc, all I can say is.
[attachimg=1]
And last but not the least, a request for the site admin.
Is there a possibility that people assuming Moderation duties are given separate IDs for moderation e.g. Moderator 1, Moderator 2 etc. That will avoid members confusing personal opinions with moderator duties and will remove a lot of flak that is happening here at least from the time i have joined.
Forum moderation is not for the faint hearted, and you can never please everyone, but evidence of double standard moderation will never please anyone.
To this effect, I find leapyfrog's post offensive, and a glaring example of double standard moderation.
Because the overall content of the post is supportive of the moderation on the forum, the foul language "nonsense" and the name calling "you're an unintelligent" hidden within the comic strip format of the message is allowed to stay up.
If I or anyone else had posted, "the moderators here are assholes and full of nonsense", the post would not last 5 minutes, and I would be muted at least, and possibly banned. But leapyfrog gets more of a pat on the back, and a here, here, bravo, well said and all that!
This is the type of double standard moderation customary here that upsets many of the forum members, which then affects the future relationships therein.
Exactly right, greenguy. I'm glad I'm not the only one who's noticed!
Granted, it may not be an easy job being a mod, but the bias here is blatant.
Quote from: Leapyfrog on September 18, 2014, 09:24:03 AMA moderated community is a nicer place to be.
In my option moderation is a fine line you should know how to bear. I personally have no problem with the overall moderation, maybe more with some of the same members moderation of the forum. By the way I just made a suggestion that the forum returns removed messages to users. perhaps by private message. Knowing the reason for the deletion can be a great plus too.
I agree good moderation makes a good forum. Nor let them do whatever they please, nor restrict the most of everything said for very small reasons. That is where the rub is. Also when there is abuse the member should be able to have the right to speak to be rectified. Fortunately here so far has been positive balance overall. Hopefully they keep it up. Some more new options regarding forum moderation and it bodes well for the times to come in this regard.
Quote from: greenguy on September 18, 2014, 12:37:39 PM
If I or anyone else had posted, "the moderators here are assholes and full of nonsense", the post would not last 5 minutes, and I would be muted at least, and possibly banned. But leapyfrog gets more of a pat on the back, and a here, here, bravo, well said and all that!
Maybe it is because of the post context? No one is calling anyone and abusing a forum member. It is just an Internet comic . This is what I mean by a small reason. To remove the comic would be lame too. Perhaps what they have to do is to edit the bad words in paint and then place the edited comic by modification of the original post. More work. What a load of situations to work without pay or thanks. No wonder nobody wants the position. You really have to appreciate who does it.- Greetings.
You need to get a grip greenguy, this is not some kiddies forum, it is a gambling forum. Gambling involves a massive amount of stress, unless of course you don't actually indulge and spend all your time theorising. Also the activity which this forum is all about can be rewarding or produce life changing outcomes. Is everybody smiley smiley and nice while risking their hard earned cash in a casino, either losing or during the pursuit of profit?
Do you have any idea how gambling changes your personality, if you win consistently, you are prone to becoming arrogant, tunnel visioned, no tolerance for fools, buy a newspaper, packet of cigarettes and you can't be bothered taking the loose change. The flip side, you are losing you can feel sick to the stomach, dark moods, severe depression, isolation, unable to meet daily needs. Don't you ever curse inside a B&M joint, or are you one that says "thank you" to the dealer after you have handed over your BR?
This is what gambling is about, this forum is about gambling, it is about trying to take money from casinos. Casinos will pull out the stops to prevent you from doing so, they don't say, "oh that's a nice system, here is your money, thank you". As for gambling forums, yes it is better when everybody is civil, but when you are battling in the trenches on a regular basis, your level of tolerance can be on the low side. Well done the mods, don't' agree with every decision they make, but better they are here than not.
Rolex-Watch,
I hear what you're saying, but the point is that the rules say no four-letter-words, and it shouldn't be one rule for one and another for someone else.
Mods are necessary, I agree. But I don't think impartiality is too much to ask of a mod.
Come the four letter word beginning with F___ is now so commonplace, you see it on tee-shirts, FCUK on billboards, this is a gambling forum, involving the pursuit of money, which is extremely stressful and can be both rewarding or damaging.
The previously mention internet cartoon was depicting an idea, not a threat to any individual(s).
Anyone could have posted that, in the current context, and it would be acceptable.
Thinking that anybody gets "special" treatment is a figment of an overactive imagination.
If anything, the Mods let some of the more "colorful" characters a bit more leeway, just to see how deep they'll bury themselves.
Guys, it's an internet forum, nothing more.
Just be civil and deal with it.
AD (don't make me call out the flying monkeys)
Quote from: Rolex-Watch on September 18, 2014, 02:03:34 PM
You need to get a grip greenguy,
Hey, I have a grip alright.
I don't really mind colourful language and feisty arguments, I was just playing advocate to make a point about double standard moderation.
I have witnessed members warned, silenced, muted and timed out for less colourful language posted in humorous thread context. I suppose those members are the one's Adulay claims are not given special treatment.
And let's call a spade a spade, it's only one mod that seems to do it and that is the mod Esoito.
I'm not trying to cause trouble, just making an observation. ANY little indiscretion with the slightest hint of distaste usually brings swift action from the mod Esoito, but not this time.
Anyway, back to roulette n stuff.
Quote from: wannawin on September 18, 2014, 01:47:53 PM
Maybe it is because of the post context? No one is calling anyone and abusing a forum member. It is just an Internet comic
It's passive aggresive, and its being allowed.
Above the comic it is titled,
There were questions raised on freedom of speech etc, all I can say is.The freedom of speech comments were by a new member, Maxwell in reply to rightly or wrongly having posts edited while going at it with XXVV.
So the comic is a direct passive aggressive taunt and insult aimed squarely at the new member, Maxwell, and any who are of like mind.
If you can't see the connection, then you've got blinkers on. The comic is insulting to those who know who they are, if you know what I mean.
Oh dear. The Wisdom of Solomon is called for. Bit of a grey area... The way I see it is this -- the poster didn't actually write the 4-letter words himself. Someone else did. Adulay alludes to that in his opening sentence.
Perhaps the Rule perhaps needs to be tightened to cover the use of 3rd party stuff on the forum.
Now, if any want to argue the point (and don't one or two members love to argue!!) then start another thread -- don't hijack this one any further! Ta.
[And, before I forget, for those two barrack-room lawyers who think I should never sleep, not have a private life away from my PC, and who obviously have no understanding of time differences and international time zones then yes, there will be inevitable delayed reactions from me occasionally.
Or, as Adulay noted, we sometimes also wait to see someone dig themselves into a deeper and deeper hole.]
Interestingly, we were reviewing a client presentation today. I sell software products for a living in simple terms. I was told the following things at the end of the presentation.
- Presentation is not quite there yet and I don't think it will give us the results we are looking for.
- I think we need an outside perspective on this pitch
- It looks like we dint interact properly on the objectives of the pitch
No one told me, "the presentation sucks"
:o
:zzz:
:footinmouth:
:upsidedown:
:thumbsup:
:zzz:
As duplicated in most theads and not necessarily in that order.
Do you people actually step foot into a B&M casino frequently? Do you have any idea what it is like to see your buyin dwindle to less than 50%. Know how that feels?
How does it feel to get battered at a table game, when all your expectations fly out the window and you wonder "what did I do to deserve this", "what signal did I miss not to venture to the casino tonight". It can be sickening, especially if you have been winning good and your confidence is sky high, only to be beaten up by the other side pulling naturals, your mind starts wondering, what has the casino done? Did they review tapes, orchestrate the deck? Is this the session were I give back my hard fought for gains in one session, which normally happens (and cursing is not allowed, are we all gentlemen and expected to take our beating with a degree of decorum?).
Thankfully I turned things around and walked 10u shy of 100% of my buyin, and your concerned by a humorous cartoon that may or may not carry some hidden message. Excuse me, just winding down after a somewhat difficult session.
Thanks for putting things in a wider perspective Rolex - your timing is impeccable as we would expect.
Please allow me while basking in tropical comfort to add a short note regarding context and perspective to this discussion.
Some notable members have claimed 'double standards' but actually when you are on the front line/ coal face/ interaction with a new and unknown third party and you have to deal in good faith, as I do, with ongoing questions and being drawn into a 'scheme'/ plot/ fantasy/ it is necessary to make a judgment call at some point so as to desist when the third party starts behaving oddly or responding with remarks that don't quite add up, and it becomes clear you are dealing with a delusional party, then it is necessary to decisively call a halt.
Now I am talking in principle here but as a 'host' I may see more, especially when PM's are involved, and sooner than a senior moderator, or global moderator.
Discretionary calls and actions are sometimes necessary and in my view the BLOG format offers levels of control which are fair.
When responding on the open forum it is not quite so 'controlled' ( but I mean that in the best sense ).
Some time-wasters I am glad to see them out the door, and there are some, with little direct experience or knowledge of this context who call for the party to return. Now I am talking only in principle here, but you see my point.
It is necessary for the community to trust the integrity and good intentions of Moderators and of course we all know there are 'tests of power' that are offered in daily experience. However let me please offer my sincere respect and knowledge of several of the moderator team here, and in particular my good friend Esoito who in my opinion has impeccable judgment in matters of ethics, values and quality control. I have asked him at some stages to give me an objective assessment and suggestions for a piece that I am writing, and I respect his comment as a professional Editor, and have frequently amended pieces that needed improvement.
Lets respect and acknowledge good work when it is done, and be forgiving in our shortcomings.
Thanks Rolex for being a realist also and acknowledging that is a battle at the tables, and very far from theory. One of the delights and challenges of a motivated semi-professional is to handle and balance the energies, the stress and control those slippery racers, the emotions.
Best to all concerned
XXVV