Quote from: Gizmotron on March 10, 2018, 02:11:09 PM

If you are saying that the online adventure is a quest to find a mindless mechanical system online and then take it into a casino to use it, assuming that no mistakes will be made, then there might not be a noticeable difference. If anyone is willing to do real world power testing of a system then the results would be the same. This is proven by expert card counters in the game of 21. But what really happens to most of these people is that they don't do the work to become expert card counters. When they go into the real casino they make mistakes. In that case there is a huge difference.


TurboGenius is still claiming that he beats the casinos with the use of hot numbers and that he does that because of mathematics. He even just made that claim today. A bunch of us set out to master his method based on breadcrumbs and clues he left online and in private conversations he had with others. I already proved I could make a rear-end of myself trying it. The only evidence of validation he could give me at this point would be his gambling winning tax return. He could somehow disclose it as proof without giving out SS numbers I suppose. It would be fascinating if he really did it. But he has been a system player for more than 13 years. He may actually believe he did it on paper. They call it confirmation bias. It's a very common mistake made by educated researchers.


If anyone that has a bet selection method that works well for them in real world practice settings, that person must also know that once they put money on the line that they could lose, they will have to face their own ability to handle any inevitable losses along the way. The system player, if they stick to the system, takes decision making out of the process. But even that is very hard to do. A very good card counter can still hit a random bad streak even though they have followed the method perfectly. That is why casinos encourage card counters to try and go for it. The casinos have made ten times as much off the wannabee card counters as they would have if the casino had just banned all of them. These amateur players almost always get taken out by their weak bankrolls. And it's real easy to find the good players and just ban them instead. So there are two kinds of online players and there are two kinds of real casino players in my opinion. There are no mindless system players that the casinos need to look out for. They do have to watch out for defective wheels though. And they still need to watch out for cheaters.

Actually saying, there are thsoe that stay on-line without going or very limited attempt at the real world translation of their on-line pre-programmed event they describe in detail within the forums and the real world gambler that actaully does whatever he says, no matter if that is winning or losing. 

For sake of explanation again, I put you into the latter 'world'.  I put some others (lots) into the first.  kind of like my kids, watch the movie 'The Black Panther', go out and buy them masks, claws and other movie stuff they pretend and play.  They go into the real world with it--yes.  But that does not make them, 'The Balck Panther' or whatever they pretend to be.  It allows them to act out and explore and expand their imaginations. 

So there are two worlds no?  The on-line adventure and the real casino world of gambling. 

And yes, if you do beat something on-line does that mean it will translate into the real casino world for an actaul pay-off repeatedly?  Etc.

Mark, Would you not agree that there are two separate worlds?  The on-line adventure to 'beat-the-casino- on paper and the real gambling world at the casinos?

The same as reading and watching a video about say, using a lawnmower and then actaully doing it??

Quote from: Bally6354 on March 09, 2018, 03:46:49 PM
That's quite a statement Giz. A young kid walked into the local supermarket store and stole a bar of candy. Mr Singh has now closed down all his 5 shops. A shame really 'eh.

But,  how many of those kids turned out to be the shooter like the 19 year old at Parkland, Florida that killed 17 other kids because of their way of thinking??

Defining events that will and do frequently happen is the foremost thing in baccarat a succesful player would desire to do when he is actaully playing.

Live baccarat versus the test or practice game on your computer are two entirely different things whatsoever.  I would hjave to liken that comparsion to watching a video of cutting a lawn with a lawnmower and the event of actaully doing the same thing.  Different and so many things can aome about but the saem principle. 

The problem so many do and expect when they study and study and find their 'gig' or 'key triggers' on the internet, is they set a schedule for themselves for that definitive wagering.  Bad, wrong and will not work. 

Frame-of-Mind with wide vision to be neutral is a huge player's plus and baccarat player's advantage overlooked by the player's ego, desires and greed as well as his desperation to recoup past losses.  The other thing he will offend himself with, is his inability to play all side of baccarat and what the shoe will eventually present.  He narrow his thoughts and preceptions to either one of the two most popular things, which is the shoe being extremely strong or weak.  He fails to admit it does both sides with a bit of the 'middle' mixed in while it does both sides or it does not do either side. 

Vision must be neutral without that typical, strong headed narrow focus in wagering for a certain event, that you are counting on coming out as a result of what happened rather than what is happening or what could happen. 

Traditional Vision:  What you see and interpret from the past which generally overrules anything else.

Traditional Thought:  What you think will happen and suit you best.  More desires than actually getting into any kind of real thought.

Traditional Results:  What had happened.  "Look at what came out", and then basing things on that.

Traditional Realization:  The whole scene in totality with limited sight, again thoinking whaty is happening is going to happen, not matter with the shoe presentment or otherwise.

Better Vision:  What can form; weak--strong--alternating--doubles--1's 2's and 3's--streaks, anything and everything, etc.

Better Thought:  Not limited to one or two sets of anything or your own desires.  Most importantly, adding pssoibilities in the correct way tot he thought processing picture.

Better Results:  Looking at them and what the total picture is into sections and events, not into a whole shoe or multiple shoes in the attempt to match statistics and long term results. 

Better Realization:  What has happened, what is yet to happen, what can or can not be 'reasonably' possible, what can happen on a more consistant and regular basis or on an infrequent and limited basis, etc. 

I limit my discussion to basically baccarat as I do not and will not play roulette.  Nothing wrong with it, i just don't play it. 

However, as I have play extensively around the USA at numerous casinos, I really do feel it is the pschy of the player, a skilled player that actaully causes his lost.

The streaks and the repeating, 'whatever' is extremely easy to make money on.  Wager $500.00 on the Banker and keep it there and press one time on the win you are riding for $1,000.00 for the 5 or 8 or 10 times the same side, Banker or if you were on Player came out.  And then you lose only the last one when it cuts.  So just say you won 8 and gave back the last one that lost.  So you won $7,000.00 and then a series of 1's, 2's and 3's came and the player's pschy directed him to to stay with the repeating style of wagering.  He could not control himself and was all hyped and motivated by the $7k win.  He gives half of it back and then the frustration sets in. 

Then he convinces himself he he should adapt to the shoe and switches to the cut or the short repeating style of wagering, etc.  He wins a few and then the shoe produces 2 longer streaks of both Bankers and Players.  The his real frustation sets in because  he knew he lost an easy $15k or so if he only did what he did with the 8 Bankers in the beginning. 

Then he switches back and the shoe switches the opposite way as well. 

That is the serious problem and what really does happen more often than not.

Then he waits and gets his thoughts back.  Then he starts to win with the cut style and the chop style of wagering a few here and there.  He is not satified with the few unit win as everyone states they do and gets rich off of.  (Which is pure B.S. because  99.9% of everyone can not and will not control themselves). 

There are numerous things to learn and abide to in a game that can produce anything at anytime and a game that will do it without mathametical reasoning.  The shoe will follow itself as well as not.  The shoe will produced everything from 20 of one of two sides to one of each side, side by side for another 20 times.  And, then the shoe will produc everything in between. 

Everyone here bascially says, just wager this or that and stick to it.  You will win so much a day.  You cannot do that everyday.  No matter what you want to say, it will and then it will not happen with any followed protocol you abide to with certain scheduled wagers.

The only way to constantly prevail at baccarat, is to wager with what the shoe is producing, if you win more than your buy in (for example) to switch over to some kind of money management system and play on the casino's money while you pocketed your buy-in and maybe 2/3rds of the win money, then attmepting to continue until you lose the 1/3rd, or whatever number percentage you work with.  But you win has to out number you lost buy-ins.  That is only accomplished with self control, complete knoweldge of what can and will happen, and expereince including losses within this game.  But for almost everyone, it is nearly impossible to walk away without getting back their loss when one occurs without further buy ins and play, and that is what sinks them.  Then you can be somewhat successful.

And, you can have thosuands of units as your bankroll as someone cites here all the time in plain generic responses.  You can wager the same thing every single day until you finally win a few units.  Then you can stop.  But the bankroll will be in the hundreds of thousands of dollars and your wagers will have to be pretty small to make it work with hundreds of units of draw downs.  LOL. 

What a tough way to make a living.  I could take that hundreds of thousand of dollars and make a great living in Haz-Mat spill clean up making tens of thosuands of dollars on small jobs and 6 figure profits on the larger jobs, where my profit to expenses ratio is around 70-80% profit. LOL.  LOL to the 100th power!!

" The question should be when to enter and exist each bias to catch the next coming one."

I can only assume 'exist' is actuality meant to be 'exit'.

Enter and exit by identifying a possible 'benefit' and your money management system has to 100% control you and you have to abide by it.

There are identifiable events that happen in baccarat, I can only assume other games as well.  I wrote some of my stronger ones that I put into tangible form.  These are mine that I have found cause winning and losing hands.  You probably will not agree, but it works for me.  My win money far exceeds my lost buy-ins that I risk.  But I employ more than a mechanical wagering system with no self-control.
   
But then there are tons of other factors most gamblers do not even realize take place.  Such as greed-ego-frame-of-mind, etc., etc., etc.  But the are player inflicted downsides and his physiological state. 

Quote from: Gizmotron on March 07, 2018, 02:36:39 PM

It's what you came for. Don't let the ending of a streak take back all your progress. Become an experienced expert at watching how trends and streaks end.[/font]

Disclaimer: I have yet to prove I can beat a casino 100 % of the time.

That is why my Money Management System protects my win money 100% of the time.  I abide by it 99.9% of the time.

I have explained it.

If I won $10,000.00 on a streak, I will lock up my buy-in and 2/3rds of the win money, done, over.

I continue with about $3,500.00 of the casinos money and attempt to win more.  If that becomes depleted with no further win money, I satisfied that 'itchy-itch', etc., etc., etc.  It works 100% of the time which I 99% of the time realize.

I wish I knew that many years ago!

Seems the past few days/week--that more and more letters that are actually typed are either changed or removed by automatic something?

Seems more entire words are changed around also or deleted as well, after being typed.

FYI.

But, how often does a man, stop doing something that feels good, great or fun??

Eating something delicious, like my home made Italian sauce over pork-beef and veal braciole (triple delight!) and pasta???

Like having sex, (if) they are allowed to continue, etc.

Like drinking free liquor for those that drink.

Like winning money??

Etc.?

I have tried my best to explain.  From my experiences and life.

Identify what the winning and losing hands truly are.  Realize they only come in 'sections'.  Change your way of wagering and realize that 'time' and the amount of play/wagers you make at the casino, really are not in your favor whatsoever.

But the highest majority, 99 + percent of everyone, here, there and elsewhere are too head strong, smart, and egotistic to realize why they actually lose and how they actually lost.

I think I defined some of it anyway, maybe not??

https://betselection.cc/alrelax's-blog/identifiable-events-in-baccarat-the-player's-advantage-9286/msg61712/#msg61712

"So IF we take Mikes assumption that after 3 losses somehow mr. edge waits around the corner and ADD this statement here, it seems to me, it needs one or two bits more than just wait for 3 losses to start betting":

It needs a huge amount more!  It does not work that way in the casino.  People try all the time.

The people mix reality with fallacy and dreams all while they are in the wrong, 'frame-of-mind'.

I have literally seen well established, smart, long time players at baccarat lose 6 to 12 hands repeatedly.  True they do not have to wager but their ego-mood-bank roll-past experiences and much more----all comes into play.  On top of it all people do not take very lightly to buying in with $10,000.00 or much more and than losing it.  I watched a female baccarat player last week actually point to the board at midway and verbally cite, "Look it has never went past 4 repeats for both banker and player".  It was at hand 43.  I told her, please understand things change and very seldom does the board hold true the whole shoe, 80 hands.  She wagers table max in 4 spots, which was $8,000.00 for the cut to the players side and 4 more bankers came out.  The time to do what she did was when it was happening in the sections that already prevailed.  But, people look for what they convince themselves are 'solid' and 'great' wagers to make and then bet on them.  That is why the casinos put those boards there, that is why they provide pens and score cards, they want you to do that.  Simple, no?  I have written about it all and many people will not truly understand or believe me, because  they have not been in a real casino or their exposure to a real casino is not very much.

I truly think it takes longer than 10 years of casino play to even start to understand the casino, the game, and yourself.  But hey--I might be totally wrong!  I don't know. 

As in any table game, but I believe Baccarat and Roulette more so than anything else.

Find and identify the winning hands/results that are produced by the table.

Be knowledgeable of those, as I have extensively written about.  (in Baccarat)

Small groups of produced hands that the player can identify as they happen, is the total key with reality and admission by the player--that a continual play will only grind themselves down and they cannot literally with unlimited play, 'beat-the-casino' as so many think.

Change your wagering protocol from the guessing you have done most of the time as well as developing a money management system that will allow you to use the win money when you win to keep playing to see how much more you can win or that is the stop play point.

Be in reality.

Risk only a limited buy-in and never re buy-in repeatedly thinking you can get whole.

(I have written about it but I believe most people still believe in the mechanical wagering system that will allow them to gamble unlimited hours and get rich). 

IMO and experience. 

Quote from: alrelax on March 06, 2018, 06:28:48 PM

I am curious sir, is 'your' or the 'PATTERN BREAKER' something you are selling or represent?

Or is it what you laid out in your first post here on Page 1, basically the 8th pattern, etc., etc., and you gave away the entire system and no one else can capitalize on it??  Or, was that an incomplete 'teaser' and there is more for sale??  Etc.?

I am lost, but hey, that's me.

I do not play roulette and never will.  I am curious as you write on the board here.  It is unclear or at least not easily identifiable as to what "PATTERN BREAKER" is. 

I hope you are not offended. 

Thank you.

And i don't believe i was disrespectful or anything similar in my posting??

And you came on your thread and could not offer the professionalism of an answer???

I figured so. 

(This post is dedicated to AysmBac.  I sat down with lots of coffee and attempted to explain, 'Defining events that will and do frequently happen in baccarat and why I wager with them or against them.  I am naming my most frequent ones.)

A benefit can also be a liability or a benefit that, carries some significant but not so obvious, cost or risk.

Read it.  Read it and read it.  That is baccarat.  There is no wagering that cannot be a risk, period.  Once you think you have no risk, you will lose any edge and advantage you may really have.

Deciphering the waves, they do exist.   

It is just that we do not know the order of the waves that the she will produce.  If you think you do and all your testing, graphs, charts and membership circles of other professional players, have told you what they are, your bankroll will disappear.  Be careful, be smart and realize that there is actually some hidden and not published knowledge to this game.  Not voodoo, but real characteristics that will present themselves as well as disappear.  That is why you need to be extremely clear-minded and able to reset and refresh yourself on a constant and repetitive manner when playing baccarat.

Numbers.  Numbers will tell you a lot in the game of baccarat.  Numbers and several years of play will generally not allow you to realize what I am about to say here.  You can believe it or not, totally up to you because it is your money.  Just, when you walk out of the casino and lost, just remember there might, just might be a bit more to baccarat than you thought.  So, you can; 1) Disbelieve it; or 2) You can shrug your shoulders and call me a terminally stupid pissant or  friggin unintelligent; or 3) Believe it; or the only other thing left you can do is; 4) Be neutral and check it out.

The shoe is infinite, it does not carry over from shoe to shoe to shoe and one continuous game as so many think and say it does.  A shoe of about 80 hands can only make so many events, combinations, waves, winning and losing hands, etc.  So in reality, one shoe of baccarat in the USA will make right around 80 hands, or 160 if you view each side as a numbered result.

I like to give the following example of a baccarat shoe and what it can do.  Which is the same as going to the beach on various days and observing the waves as they come into the shoreline (the beach).  Smooth, rough, high, low, equaling out, the same for a while, abruptly being different and varying greatly, etc., etc., etc. and so on.  At 9 AM the waves will be different than they generally are at 1 PM and again at 2 AM later on, as well as the same time the following day.  At times they will certainly look the same as well, at other times completely opposite.  But, the beach and the people are still there, just adapting to the waves in different ways depending on the volatility of the waves and the person's ability to subject themselves to them.

Reality with various manifesting phenomena mixed in.  That is baccarat.

So many say; What has already happened is past, it has no bearing on what will happen.  That is true to a certain extent, but what has happened needs to be considered within your vision because the shoe you are playing out is finite and only so many things can or will happen.  Misinterpreting and alienating yourself from what I am attempting to lay out, will not open your vision or allow yourself to be in the proper frame-of-mind.

Presentments of general characteristics of a section being dealt---in the process---currently happening in front of you, is what you need to attempt understanding of and what is also possible to happen.  And, do not let prediction become fallacy, as well don't let fallacy become prediction for yourself.  Remember reality and stay in it.

After you read through the following, make sure to grasp the paragraph below with the word Different in bold letters!  Some of my identified and stringer presentments that have served me well.

Additions and Reductions, on 3 card draws.  As soon as one side begins to get additions, particularly the player side and the banker side is reduced by its 3rd card be alert for that event to continue.  Once it happens a 2nd time in a row particularly within the first half of the shoe or the middle section, it might favor the continuance of doing that numerous times.  Likewise a reduction to the players side and the banker winning with the first 2 cards or the third card that increases.  However, IMO and experience the first one is usually stronger overall and continues longer.

6/7s & 8s/9s.  Without anything else, I have found that 1 point wins and 1 point losses for both hands, tends to lend itself to the worst rationalization of what the next hand will bring, more often than not.  As well as any other numbers that prevail and lose this is the worst that brings total randomness, continuance and any other chain of events that almost no one can profit off of.

Naturals-alternating.  An event exists to be exploited when alternating naturals appear frequently.  Naturals have a huge tendency to 'WOW' the players and they convince themselves that the side just got strong and aggressively wager the same side that the natural just prevailed on.  However, naturals are frequent and have a tendency to bounced or alternate back and forth for a short event more often than not, especially when the - or + is close together.

Naturals.  When one side is producing naturals over the other sides 6-7 or 8's and winning it is an event that can be exploited frequently.  Meaning, for example, P has 6 and B has 7, then P has a N8 and B had a N9, etc., or the opposite.

Fortune 7s (3 card Banker winning 7s, 40:1). Zero to low ties.  Within the first 10 hands.  And hands 16-23.  Those are the most frequent events when the shoe produces the F-7 hand.  Frequently shoes have 1 or 2 F-7s.  Some shoes have none.  If a 3rd F-7 does appear, generally there is a 4th.  5 and 6 F-7s are a bit infrequent or rare but do occur.  Or, should I say you will not generally see that in every other shoe or every third shoe, etc.  By the way, the reason there are more F-7s in the beginning of the shoe than elsewhere and on a more frequent basis is the number of cards in the shoe of course.  Frequently there are many 10s that form the first 3 or 4 cards dealt and then a larger card reducing the players side under 6 or remaining at 6 and drawing an Ace through a 7 to make the 3 card 7 on the Banker side, etc.

-10/+10/+20. Frequently the total count will hover around - or +10 somewhere between hand 15 and midway or so.  And then favor the deficit side in smaller hit rates for its attempt to catch-up.  It happens and happens repeatedly.  Much rarer an event, one side will continue to +20 and continue to rise.  Infrequent by far.  I have only witnessed a handful of shoes be able to provide the + side that was already well over +15, say +17 to +20 or so and then produce a streak on top of that.  Depending on how far into the shoe it is, the deficit side usually (USUALLY) makes a pretty good attempt to catch-up to the other side. The key thing in this event as I have found, is the deficient side will usually catch-up  in a slow grind by not allowing the + side to streak or repeat as it was previously.  Depending on the hand of the shoe, I have done extremely well and won larger wagers based on these events siding with the - or the + of a side to win or lose.   

Equaling Out.  The highest numbers of shoes will equal out in how many winning hands each side ended up with and if not equal, within 3 to 5 of each other as next most favorable.  An event to be exploited along the shoe after the first 1/3rd of the shoe, many times.  If not, after the midway or 60% point.  Another easy exploit that comes along frequently is when it is within 1 or 2 of each other.  Example, 27-28, then 28-28, then 28-29, then 29-29, then 30-29, etc.  That event to me has won many a large wager, the same as a streak of any one side continuing.

Half Way to End of Shoe.  More often than not, when the first half of the shoe was strong, frequently repeating Bs and Ps and other distinctive continuing trends that formed, the second half is one to be extremely careful of it continuing.  Sure, great if it does.  But when you play long enough, this is one of the easiest and most profitable events that can be exploited big time for it to be almost the opposite of the first half.

Alternating & 2s.  No rhyme or reason, nothing I have ever found that will point to the successful and continued outcome of chops and/or 2s.  If they appear within a section they can be exploited as it is an event that frequently happens.

Being there when it is happening.  Consciousness, frame-of-mind and wide & clear vision.  I have wrote about all this in other threads.  Most of all, reality.  Stay in reality while being in La La land and Dreamsville.  Hard to do at times, but you must.

You do not have to wager or count on these events to happen.  But they do happen and when it is not streaking 10 or 15 or 19 of one side, the shoe is presenting other things or events.  And these are what I found over the many years I have played this game.

What you have to do, is put yourself into the wholeness the shoe is presenting and divide it up into sections.  Interpret it as waves with some type of volatility that will happen or like a tree with its branches.  But continuously go back with your vision each hand and do not forget the main stream is just the tree trunk.

Experience is vital.  Without it you are basically at the tables mercy, the mercy of the aura of the surrounding you are in and the mercy of the other players as well.  Do not say that those are not powerful, as the most certainly are!  Again--reality!

Example, when you see someone win thousands of dollars in a couple of hands you will be drawn to that individuals wagering results, which was, he won!  You most likely will follow him and then he loses.  Welcome to the game of baccarat.

Being able to differentiate what is happening as it is happening.  Ask yourself, what is different or making it different.  A lot of times there is just that lurking there without anyone noticing.  You have to be able to classify the make ups of the hands presenting themselves as, strong, weak or neutral or balancing out.  Those 4 things will lead and control each section in one way or another.  And do not view 80 hands as 1, you have to divide the shoe up into 3 to 5 sections as the majority of the times that is better representing what is happening and forming, rather than 20 or 30 or 40 hands ago, etc.  You should only be concerned in a section, not looking at what happened back in the beginning, remember that.

More often than not (by far) a section of 15-20 hands is far greater representative of itself than outside of its section.  Presentment, Reality & Actual Events.

Nothing is 100% indicative that anything will continue or happen.  But be aware and let your vision go either way, with or against, ready to stack it up and pounce on it or go wait a section out.  You better maintain complete visual and aura consciousness, the correct frame-of-mind and keep saying the word, reality. 

Quote from: JOHN LEGEND MK2 on March 06, 2018, 04:01:06 PM
.

Sad for them. I will play PATTERN BREAKER in all its incarnations for the rest of my life.

I am curious sir, is 'your' or the 'PATTERN BREAKER' something you are selling or represent?

Or is it what you laid out in your first post here on Page 1, basically the 8th pattern, etc., etc., and you gave away the entire system and no one else can capitalize on it??  Or, was that an incomplete 'teaser' and there is more for sale??  Etc.?

I am lost, but hey, that's me.

I do not play roulette and never will.  I am curious as you write on the board here.  It is unclear or at least not easily identifiable as to what "PATTERN BREAKER" is. 

I hope you are not offended. 

Thank you.