We do not have to support magical thinking, complicated thinking, technicalities, or advanced courses. Let us simply place area 1-36 in a square or grid (6x6). I am not a numerologist, so there´s nothing magical in there. The 1st horizontal line is simply with 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, and 6. ETC. I have earlier spelled this out in vls roulette forum.
Most of us probably know, that SIX numbers may fail to come for at long time. So it might not be smart :no: to bet, that all six numbers in any horizontal or vertical group are bound to come soon. THE APPEARANCE OF AT LEAST FIVE NUMBERS IN A ROW IN ONE OF THESE GROUPS SEEMS TO BE A BETTER GOAL. When I reach this simple goal, I win (Straight Up) and end the session.
One session per day in my free test at home with pen and paper. As usual I begin with the first spin from 2011, table 3, Spielbank Wiesbaden.
The 31 sessions of January 2011 resulted in 334 chips. The first four months of 2011 (119 sessions) resulted in 389 chips.
I hope that some of you are willing to do more tests. Thanks.
I thought this was an interesting proposition with the results posted by Dane, so started testing it myself, & then playing it.
To date, I've played a little over 70 sessions (live dealer, single zero).
The only change I made was to put a stoploss of 60u on a single game, to try & avoid any RFH.
After 10 sessions +129
20 +261
30 +417
40 +371
50 +431
60 +425
70 +473
Looking back over these sessions, the stoploss has actually cost me another 89units, so it may be set too low.
Perhaps a round 100u would be better (I would be at +562u).
Like with Dane's tests, it got off to a flyer but then evened out. Whether it would slowly drop back or another positive burst would push it upwards again as in the first 30 sessions, I'm not sure.
So, my results (without the stoploss, & according to Dane's original rules) added to those of Dane would give 189 sessions & a total of +951units.
It's easy to play this system alongside other ones if you want. You can see at a glance what needs to be bet & doesn't usually take much tracking before you get a game.
:thumbsup:
Thanks to monaco for testing! A stoploss of course requires more tests. I looked once again at the "Permanenzen" from table 3, Spielbank Wiesbaden. With a stoploss close to 60 units I stopped without winning on day 14, 20, 24, 33, 36, 46, and 53. Seven times within the first two months of 2011 (59 sessions).
-59-60-57-59-57-57-57 = -349. Without any stoploss: -35-77-37-139-36-106-31 = -461.
Mmm, in my sessions, the 60u stoploss came into use on 6 occasions during the 70 sessions.
I would've got a hit on the next spin on 4 occasions, which was frustrating; only once did it go over 100u on a game (up to about 120u drawdown before a hit).
Whether the stoploss will affect the overall outcome, I'm not sure (in your sample it worked out, in mine it didn't) - but at the least it may help to stay on a narrower path, avoiding the bigger spiked drawdowns.
I considered various MM strategies to boost profit, but couldn't really find the right one. :-\
I used a Guetting progression over the sessions in real play, which had put another +50u on the final flatbet total.
When there was a loss, it was due to lots of repeaters.
I´ll keep on testing :nod: . Unfortunately I threw my first notes away. So it may take a day or two to work my way through the lists from March and April 2011 again. This time with different stoplosses.
Question Dane: how do you cope with a hit? ...do you:
A: Wipe the tracking card, adding new numbers as they are spun.
B: Re-use old numbers by marking them down in reverse order until there's a bet, then start adding new numbers as they are spun.
Thank you!
Dane,
If 1,2,4,5,6 are hit, are you betting the 3 for the 5 in a row or does this negate your initial proposition of not waiting for the 6 in a row?
Thanks, Gator
Thanks for your questions. Answer to Vic: A. Starting anew.
To Gator: I am betting the 3 in your example. The final goal is AT LEAST five in a row.
An error in Reply #2: The sum of the seven results with the stoploss is not -349 as I wrote, but -406. You did not see that coming, did you? Sorry. :stress: My mistake.
monaco introduced the stoploss factor here :-\ . As promised I have analyzed my first 119 sessions again. Neither stoploss -60 nor stoploss -100 made me richer compared to no stoploss. Stoploss -60 made me 19 units poorer. And stoploss -100 made be 7 units poorer.
So in my continued test series I intend to do without stoploss :) .
At best there's been mixed results with it - no point introducing it for the sake of it :thumbsup:
More tests will hopefully show worst case scenarios.
My continued test series after exactly five months (at table 3, Spielbank Wiesbaden): 379 chips. Three days later (03.06.2011): 451 chips. 10.06.2011: 183 chips.
After exactly six months (178 hits or sessions): 522 chips. :nod:
Well, great!! I played it all wrong and made a video of it all wrong.
To monaco: A stoploss might be valuable after all. Right after hit 184(06.07.2011): 647 chips (Without stoploss).
Right after hit 202(24.07.2011): 201 chips.
Then my worst case so far: The first 64 spins from 25.07.2011. This session from Spielbank Wiesbaden resulted in -172 chips. In other words: 29 chips left!
Quote from: Dane on January 24, 2013, 07:11:47 AM
To monaco: A stoploss might be valuable after all. Right after hit 184(06.07.2011): 647 chips (Without stoploss).
Right after hit 202(24.07.2011): 201 chips.
Then my worst case so far: The first 64 spins from 25.07.2011. This session from Spielbank Wiesbaden resulted in -172 chips. In other words: 29 chips left!
A stoploss is just a break if you do not change the method. You must start again from the lower balance later on.
What were the worst results from the other sessions that brought the balance down?
Is it possible to work out how it would be looking with a 100u stoploss?
If that can level out the spikes, it might be possible to find an MM scheme that helps keep/boost profits, whether it's 'add half a unit after x units are won'.
As I said before, I was using a Guetting progression over-arching all the sessions, & at different points I was between 50units & 100units above the flatbetting total, regressing to minimum units after a loss, slowly increasing the base unit on an upward trend.
Add the MM to the stoploss and who knows.. :)
To Ralph and monaco: I have been rather :-\ undecided. And I am sorry to admit that Ralph may be right: STOPLOSS is not going to save us. Just look at the 18 sessions from 07.07.2011 to 24.07.2100, Spielbank Wiesbaden, table 3!
WITHOUT any stoploss: -102+31+22+8-70+7-12-58-6-1-58-43-53+16+3+9-38-118 = -463
And WITH a stoploss: -100+31+22+8-99+7-12-58-6-1-58-43-53+16+3+9-38-98 = -470 :(
Repeaters seem to dominate from time to time. Maybe be cannot afford to ignore this simple fact. So my new goal is at least five numbers in a row without any repeat - OR AT LEAST THREE REPEATED NUMBERS IN A ROW.
07.07.2011 (table 3, Spielbank Wiesbaden): 29 spins. +29 chips. Winning on 3. Repeated numbers in a row: 1, 2, 3, 4.
08.07.2011. 25 spins. Winning on 3. +34 chips. Five numbers without repeat: 2, 3, 4, 5, 6.
09.07.2011. 26 spins. Winning on 24. +33 chips. 20, 21, 22, 23, 24 did not repeat.
10.07.2011. 50 spins. Winning on 10. -43 chips. Three repeated numbers 9, 10, 11.
11.07.2011. 25 spins. Winning on 13. +26 chips. Three repeated numbers in a row (vertical): 13, 19, 25.
12.07.2011. 26 spins. Winning on 22. +33 chips. Repeated numbers in a row: 21, 22, 23, 24.
13.07.2011. 29 spins. Winning on 20. +17 chips. Six numbers without repeat: 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24.
14.07.2011. 32 spins. Winning on 13. +13 chips. Three repeated numbers in a row (vertical): 7, 13, 19.
15.07.2011. 19 spins. Winning on 3. +34 chips. 1, 2, 3 repeated themselves.
16.07.2011. 44 spins. Winning on 16. +12 chips. 14, 15, 16 repeated.
These ten sessions resulted in...........178 chips.
Thanks to monaco for his inspiration and support.
Thank you. Insightful information.
"five numbers in a row without a repeat"
Could you kindly show an example of this.
Regards
Bruce
Quote from: Badger on March 02, 2013, 08:40:56 AM
"five numbers in a row without a repeat"
Could you kindly show an example of this.
Regards
Bruce
Sure! Here I have chosen the first spins from 20.07.2011, table 3, Spielbank Wiesbaden:
6, 3, 21, 33, 2, 19, 31, 7, 27, 21, 23, 16, 29, 0, 5, 6, 13, 30, 3, 22, 23, 27, 6, 25.
In the upper line of the grid 6, 3, 2 and 5 came. I started betting on 4. But in the next spin 6 repeated. I left 4.
AT LEAST five numbers in a row without a repeat turned up in the vertical group of 1, 7, 13, 19, 25, 31.
In this order: 19, 31, 7, 13 (here I started betting on 25)...and 25. This session ended here.
In the final spins I also betted 22 and 33. 22 could have repeated (21 and 23 repeated themselves)
And 33 could come again (21 and 27 did).
Thanks Dane
I'm going to do some testing.
Quote from: Badger on March 02, 2013, 04:01:38 PM
Thanks Dane
I'm going to do some testing.
Here are the results from the next eight days in my own test series: 5-20 5 23-10-63-32 9. I.e. the 18 sessions from 07.07.2011 to 24.07.2011 resulted in 95 chips. Compared to minus 463 chips :stress: (mentioned at the top of this page) that is something :nod: ! My new version passed what I considered to be "the acid test".
Not surprising I once again have started with the first spin of 2011. In theory the 31 sessions of January 2011 made me 63 chips richer.
According to my latest testing this is even better: Heading for AT LEAST FOUR "oners" in a row OR
AT LEAST FOUR repeated numbers in a row :nod:
1 2 3 4 5 6
7 8 9 10 11 12
13 14 15 16 17 18
19 20 21 22 23 24
25 26 27 28 29 30
31 32 33 34 35 36
Dane
Would you please quote this chart and color the "oners" one color and the "repeaters" another color?
Sam
Quote from: TwoCatSam on March 10, 2013, 05:07:16 PM
1 2 3 4 5 6
7 8 9 10 11 12
13 14 15 16 17 18
19 20 21 22 23 24
25 26 27 28 29 30
31 32 33 34 35 36
Dane
Would you please quote this chart and color the "oners" one color and the "repeaters" another color?
Sam
In my first post of this topic I told you, that I earlier spelled something out in vls roulette forum. Suddenly I remember who I tried to explain it to. Must be a joker!
:nod: :nod: :nod: :nod:
Dane
I am not a joker. Frankly, I posted your very first system on this forum and raved about it. I have used it several times at my local Indian casino and have never lost with it.
Where is the joker in that?
You are a very insulting person to someone who just wants clarification. You may rest assured, I will not ask you another question.
Sam
I really thought he was a joker. Now and then we should take the time to read, think and understand before judging or posting. A little clarification: Here the 36 numbers belongs to a grid (6x6 spaces). Without having to colour anything, you must place 12 EXACTLY under 6. And so forth. Please remember: Follow the development both in the horizontal and vertical groups. When a number comes, I simply write it in its proper place. And if it comes again, I cross it out.
With the previous version of the strategy I had a bad day the with 161 permanence of 2011 (12.06.2011, table 3, Spielbank Wiesbaden): MINUS 190 chips.
With the newest version I lost only 14 chips that day..
The ninteen days (sessions) from 07.07.2011 to 25.07.2011 resulted in +93 chips with the previous version. With the new version: +137 chips.
Forum
I've done a couple of things for this forum and others over the years. I ask little.
If there is anyone who understands what the man is doing, would you explain it to me?
Sam
From my initial post here on this topic: "The 1st horizontal line is simply with 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, and 6. Etc. I have earlier spelled this out in vls roulette forum". Anyone can see how a certain member there started to ask (reply #3) and colouring numbers. See also #8. In reply #15 he started attaching sheets. In the attached sheet of reply #17 he seemed to have found the key. And he is not a joker!!!!
I work in a kindergarten. Some of the kids are playing with colours and do not have much patience.
To whom it may concern:
Today at 02:14:52 PM in THIS forum I stated that we should take the time to read, think and understand before judging or posting.
Today at 02:23:18 PM a certain member had already given up understanding.
I have just had a look at Peter Russell´s World Clock. The spinning numbers there can make you dizzy. Time flies!
Hi Sam
Maybe this will help. On the attached excel sheet the green represents a number coming up, the yellow a repeater and the red numbers are the numbers to bet.
The first block started at spin 1, the next at spin 10 , the next at spin 20 etc.
I have'nt kept score to see how many units I've won.
B.
Quote from: TwoCatSam on March 10, 2013, 05:07:16 PM
1 2 3 4 5 6
7 8 9 10 11 12
13 14 15 16 17 18
19 20 21 22 23 24
25 26 27 28 29 30
31 32 33 34 35 36
Dane
Would you please quote this chart and color the "oners" one color and the "repeaters" another color?
Sam
I'm coding a
[6x6] tag to automate this.
A little more basic knowledge to the patient reader: FIVE in a row within a group of six can be placed in two ways. And we are looking at twelfe groups of six.
So heading for at least FIVE "oners" in a row or at least FIVE repeated numbers in a row might be even better.
The patient reader might examine the permanence from 05.02.2011, table 3, Spielbank Wiesbaden.
Before (with "four/ four") I had to bet nine numbers in the end of the session. And I lost 150 units.
Now (with "five/five") I only bet three numbers in the end. Result: -10 units.
Another member involved in testing mailed me ans suggested this:
At least FOUR "oners" in a row/at least FIVE repeated numbers in a row.
Who knows. This might be the best version so far.
so basically you wait till you have 4 "oners" or 4 repeated numbers in a row (verticaly or horizontaly doesn't matter) and then bet for the 4 to become 5 in a row? right?
what if you have 2,3,4,5 - will you bet 1 or 6? or both?
:no:
Quote from: soggett on March 18, 2013, 10:10:36 AM
so basically you wait till you have 4 "oners" or 4 repeated numbers in a row (verticaly or horizontaly doesn't matter) and then bet for the 4 to become 5 in a row? right?
what if you have 2,3,4,5 - will you bet 1 or 6? or both?
In Reply #32 another version was mentioned. But let us just assume, that we stick to this goal:
At least FIVE "oners" in a row/at least FIVE repeated numbers in a row.
If we are able to reach the goal with the next spin, we bet. There are several possibilities, but let us just look at examples from the first horizontal group. If 2, 3, 4, 5 are "oners", we bet both 1 and 6.
At least five in a row, however, do not have to develop from four in a row. Five "oners": 1, 2, 4, 5, 6. In this case we bet 3.
If 2, 3, 4, 5 are repeaters, and neither 1 nor 6 has come, we do not bet. If 1 has come once, we place one chip there. And if 6 has come once, we place one chip there. If we are able to reach the goal in the very next spin, we bet. And if we win: No more bets, thank you :no: . CHEERS
Dane
thanks
I got it now :thumbsup:
Quote from: Dane on March 18, 2013, 07:17:03 AM
Another member involved in testing mailed me ans suggested this:
At least FOUR "oners" in a row/at least FIVE repeated numbers in a row.
Who knows. This might be the best version so far.
This other member involved in serious testing has kindly given his permission to write this: monaco. Thanks :) to monaco.
My sessions from the first twenty days of 2011.
"FIVE/FIVE": 23+34+28+11-5+11+29-2-55 +/-0, -34-87+6-47-80+30-1-41+30+8.
"FOUR/FIVE":31+27+26+25+17-15+27-4+20+30+14+12+34+6-5+32-7-11-7+15.
I´ll pick the new version ("FOUR/FIVE")
and go through the last days of January 2011, Spielbank Wiesbaden: -16+28+10+30+27-43-1+2-18-31+6.
The 31 sessions from that month: 249 units.
Perhaps monaco would be a gentleman and tell us how to play this system.
Quote from: TwoCatSam on March 20, 2013, 05:34:32 PM
Perhaps monaco would be a gentleman and tell us how to play this system.
The way I've been testing is to look for either 4 in a row 'oners' or five in a row repeats (four/five).
So you've got your 6x6 grid:
[attachimg=1]
By 4 in a row oners, it means we're looking to bet on numbers that would give us 4 numbers in a row (either vertical or horizontal) that have hit once & only once. As soon as a numbers hits twice, it is no long a 'oner'.
For example, the numbers come out: 3, 8, 16, 22, 14, 36, 35, 26 - this looks like this (hit numbers in bold):
[attachimg=2]
so we're betting on 20 to give us four 'oners' in a row: 8-14-20-26
5 repeaters in a row is the same principle, just that we're looking for 5 numbers in a row (again either horizontally or vertically) that have have hit at least twice.
This is some results from Wiesbaden -
Jan 2012: +176
Feb 2012: +282
Mar 2012: -2
Apr 2012: -29
so that's 120 sessions for +427u.
The worst single sessions so far have been -140u & -108u.
This is with no money management at all, just flat-staking until a hit, then moving on to the first spins of the following day.
There's a couple of possibilities for MM, such as simply ending the session when you run out of 'oners' to play (the oners will get the hit over 90% of the time), or increasing the stake by maybe half a unit if you have to start betting on the repeaters. Haven't really tested that enough though.
The general way it seems to work is that the oners will get the hit - if they don't it's because the table is throwing out a lot of repeaters, which in itself will limit the number of 'oners' you can play. It's generally 2-6 numbers, but sometimes it can go up to 7-9 numbers.
Dane's being generous to say about my permission! Just trying to get a decent number of sessions completed.
monaco
Thank you so much for that explanation. Now consider your words: By 4 in a row oners, it means we're looking to bet on numbers that would give us 4 numbers in a row (either vertical or horizontal) that have hit once & only once. As soon as a numbers hits twice, it is no long a 'oner'.
Suppose the 4 hits and I circle it as a "oner". It hits again and I erase my circle. (Or do I X that number out?) Suppose it hit a third time? Would it be a "new oner"? Of if it has hit twice, is it dead (Xed out) for that game.
I read somewhere Dane talked of betting two numbers in one row. Do you do that? How is that possible?
EDIT: Oh, I see. He was playing for five oners.
Thanks again and thanks for the chart.
Sam
Quote from: TwoCatSam on March 21, 2013, 04:04:13 PM
Suppose the 4 hits and I circle it as a "oner". It hits again and I erase my circle. (Or do I X that number out?) Suppose it hit a third time? Would it be a "new oner"? Of if it has hit twice, is it dead (Xed out) for that game.
That's exactly how you can do it - say the number 4 hits, circle it - you know it's hit once. If it hits again, put a cross through it - you know it's hit more than once. There's only 3 states it can be - unhit, a oner, or a repeater. Once it's hit twice, it just counts as a repeater for the rest of the game, no matter how many more times it hits, it doesn't change status again.
Quote
I read somewhere Dane talked of betting two numbers in one row. Do you do that? How is that possible?
EDIT: Oh, I see. He was playing for five oners.
Thanks again and thanks for the chart.
Sam
There is a situation where you can be betting more than 1 number in a line - if the numbers came 1, 3, 4, 6, you would be betting 2
& 5, as either would make 4 in a row.
monaco
You are a gentleman and a scholar!!
Thank you so much.
I may pay to bot this puppy.
Sam
no worries Sam, any time.
Our forum now has a 6x6 tag for better illustration of the bet.
Usage is quite simple:
[6x6]1,2,3,4,5,1[/6x6]
You enclose numbers within the tag. Singles are highlighted in yellow, repeaters are highlighted in blue.
Enjoy!
Vic
[6x6]1,2,3,4,5,1[/6x6]
Outputs:
[6x6]1,2,3,4,5,1[/6x6]
Thanks Vic,
I've been trying this idea and greatly appreciate your efforts.
Trebor
Where do I get my hands on it Vic?
Trebor
It's implemented forum-wide Trebor,
Feel free to copy-paste the example into your post "as is":
[6x6]1,2,3,4,5,1[/6x6]
You can start from it.
Simply a matter of editing your numbers in between the 6x6 tags :nod:
I'm probably the only one on the forum that has no idea what you mean Vic ???
Trebor
Quote from: VLS on March 22, 2013, 12:56:07 AM
[6x6]1,2,3,4,5,1[/6x6]
Trebor - just type in exactly what it says above & press 'post'..
[6x6]12,3,7,9,10,5[/6x6]
Thanks monaco
I made a small program to track the numbers
I hope it is useful :thumbsup:
(https://betselection.cc/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi50.tinypic.com%2Fxc7f7.png&hash=9d81634762d7e74c64258197126eff4cc252a998)
Thank you, Cristal. That looks very nice, indeed!
Sam
Wowie Cristal, you're on fire!
Thanks a bunch for sharing it with us :thumbsup: :thumbsup: :thumbsup:
Nice tracker there!
There is nothing like stating the obvious: TIME is still important! . And good things happen when you get your priorities straight. Not all people have the patience to develop, digest and test a strategy properly. The lists from the first four months of 2012, table 3, Spielbank Wiesbaden, have been successfully analyzed by monaco. Well begun is half done. My test series started in the permanence archive (table 3) the previous year.
January 2011: +249 units
February 2011 : -128 -
March 2011 : +234 - .
In other words: 355 units.
Quote from: monaco on March 21, 2013, 01:34:51 PM
This is some results from Wiesbaden -
Jan 2012: +176
Feb 2012: +282
Mar 2012: -2
Apr 2012: -29
so that's 120 sessions for +427u.
The worst single sessions so far have been -140u & -108u.
This is with no money management at all, just flat-staking until a hit, then moving on to the first spins of the following day.
so you are playing for 1 hit a day?
why not more, like till you are in plus for that day?
how many spins per day is it on average?
Quote from: soggett on March 23, 2013, 10:57:58 AM
so you are playing for 1 hit a day?
why not more, like till you are in plus for that day?
how many spins per day is it on average?
Hi soggett! Of course monaco can speak for himself, if he has got the time. But as we are testing the same method, I´ll try to explain, why I (for my part) am only heading for one hit: Nobody can guarantee a plus per day. Waiting for a plus just before closing time can be most stressfull. Time is still most important! That´s why it is hard to find a clock on the wall at the roulette table. :zzz:
Quote from: soggett on March 23, 2013, 10:57:58 AM
so you are playing for 1 hit a day?
yesQuote
why not more, like till you are in plus for that day?
that is a possibility -
As Dane says though, you can't guarantee reaching a + moment, so you'd then need to consider if you wanted some kind of stoploss in case you didn't reach plus at any point, or play the game until its natural end when there are no more numbers to bet & just see where you were.
I did look into it a bit before (not with this particular version, but when we first started testing the original 5 in a row), sometimes it works well with the 2nd & 3rd hit not far behind the 1st, but... of course sometimes it didn't, so then you would need to decide what you were going to do - work out your mm basically.
The '5 repeaters in a row' mainly plays the part of bringing the session to an end if the 4 oners in a row don't win (which they will do 90% of the time).
At some point
there has to be 5 repeaters in a row.
There doesn't have to be 4 oners in a row during any game.
Quote
how many spins per day is it on average?
Off the top of my head, I would say on average 20-40
Is a repeater always treated the same however many times it's shown up? That is, if you're betting to get five repeaters in a row, it makes no difference how many times the other four have shown?
Trebor
Quote from: Trebor on March 23, 2013, 05:26:05 PM
Is a repeater always treated the same however many times it's shown up? That is, if you're betting to get five repeaters in a row, it makes no difference how many times the other four have shown?
Trebor
YES! A reapeater is always treated the same way.
20-40 spins on average off the top of our heads may not help us, if we do not catch the train >:D .One session may take five spins. Or 85 spins (05.04.2011, table 3).
22.04.2011: No spin from table 3. So I examined only 29 lists from that April. +171 units.
The 119 sessions from the first four months of 2011 in Spielbank Wiesbaden: +526 units :)
As you may remember, monaco went throught the first four months of 1012. Result: +427 units :)
I hope that we are able to continue our test series.
01.05.2011. No spin from table 3. So I examined only 30 lists from that May. Result: +235 units. I must have been EXTREMELY LUCKY!
The 149 sessions from the first five months of 2011 in Spielbank Wiesbaden: +761 units :)
Dare I ask a question without being called a name??
Well, I've been called names before so here goes...............
Dane
Are you playing strictly "onses"? Four out of five or five out of six or both? Are you playing the doubles? Do you quit the game after the first win. It does your readers no good if you only post results and fail to post how you got them.
If you find my questions stupid, just don't answer.
Sam
Quote from: TwoCatSam on March 25, 2013, 12:53:13 PM
Dare I ask a question without being called a name??
Well, I've been called names before so here goes...............
Dane
Are you playing strictly "onses"? Four out of five or five out of six or both? Are you playing the doubles? Do you quit the game after the first win. It does your readers no good if you only post results and fail to post how you got them.
If you find my questions stupid, just don't answer.
Sam
In Reply # 41 you called monaco a gentleman and a scholar. We are testing the version, he had just described to you. This is why it makes sense to add his results to mine. TIME is still important. I hope that we´ll be able to continue the test series. Slow and steady wins the race.
Thank you!
Soon the moon is full. It keeps changing like the eyes of a cat. From the table we might not be able to see the natural light 8) and rhytms from the sun and the moon; but I believe that we are under the influence. I do not intend to reach for the moon - or transcend TIME here. I feel fine and ready to supply you with the test results from table 3, June 2011. No spin came from there 23.06.2011. So I had only 29 hits or sessions. The duration (number of spins): 89, 13, 13, 25, 15, 19, 22, 13, 11, 25, 52, 26, 18, 19, 31, 21, 31, 28, 60, 44, 22, 15, 25, 32, 17, 62, 30, 31, 26.
Units: -119+34+24+10+20+27+11+32+33-1-34-22+13+20-22+21+24-1-61-8+11+27-3+28+6-28+11-16+16 +53. :)
In total the first six months included 178 sessions or hits and resulted in +814 units.
Quote from: Dane on March 26, 2013, 07:31:29 AM
Soon the moon is full. It keeps changing like the eyes of a cat. From the table we might not be able to see the natural light 8) and rhytms from the sun and the moon; but I believe that we are under the influence. I do not intend to reach for the moon - or transcend TIME here. I feel fine and ready to supply you with the test results from table 3, June 2011. No spin came from there 23.06.2011. So I had only 29 hits or sessions. The duration (number of spins): 89, 13, 13, 25, 15, 19, 22, 13, 11, 25, 52, 26, 18, 19, 31, 21, 31, 28, 60, 44, 22, 15, 25, 32, 17, 62, 30, 31, 26.
Units: -119+34+24+10+20+27+11+32+33-1-34-22+13+20-22+21+24-1-61-8+11+27-3+28+6-28+11-16+16 +53. :)
In total the first six months included 178 sessions or hits and resulted in +814 units.
very nice results
have you considered having a stop loss of 36 units perhaps? since you go for 1 win only, going over 36 units will put you in minus on a win
Quote from: soggett on March 26, 2013, 07:50:03 AM
very nice results
have you considered having a stop loss of 36 units perhaps? since you go for 1 win only, going over 36 units will put you in minus on a win
Or you might want to consider playing longer sessions
quick test 100 spins
ends +78
4/5 version
Quote from: soggett on March 26, 2013, 08:03:27 AM
Or you might want to consider playing longer sessions
quick test 100 spins
ends +78
4/5 version
Quote from: soggett on March 26, 2013, 07:50:03 AM
very nice results
have you considered having a stop loss of 36 units perhaps? since you go for 1 win only, going over 36 units will put you in minus on a win
Thanks! One quick test does not prove anything. What it going to happen in the long run? I have not got the time :zzz: to test your ideas. Anyone with much time and patience: Feel free to start longer test series.
Test results for Jan-June 2012, Wiesbaden, alternating daily between Table 2 & 3, playing four/five:
Jan: +176
Feb: +282
Mar: -2
Apr: -29
May: +155
Jun: +448
Total: +1030u (178 sessions)
June had only 3 losing days of -3, -21 & -25.
It's useful to look closer at May 2012 also, which was much more variable:
up +200 after 15 days, it then dropped -230 in 3 days, before recovering to +155 by the months end.
The 3 consecutive loss days were -104, -83, -45.
Quote from: monaco on March 26, 2013, 11:47:05 AM
Test results for Jan-June 2012, Wiesbaden, alternating daily between Table 2 & 3, playing four/five:
Jan: +176
Feb: +282
Mar: -2
Apr: -29
May: +155
Jun: +448
Total: +1030u (178 sessions)
June had only 3 losing days of -3, -21 & -25.
It's useful to look closer at May 2012 also, which was much more variable:
up +200 after 15 days, it then dropped -230 in 3 days, before recovering to +155 by the months end.
The 3 consecutive loss days were -104, -83, -45.
Hi monaco; your results are even more impressive than mine! Yes, it is useful to look closer at some periods. We cannot know for sure, however, how many chips we´ll need tomorrow.
The session always starts with the first spin of the day. We do not want to manipulate results :no: :no: by chossing another starting point.
And I do not want to choose another table whenever I feel like it. Why are you alternating between table 2&3?
Quote from: Dane on March 26, 2013, 12:22:59 PM
Hi monaco; your results are even more impressive than mine! Yes, it is useful to look closer at some periods. We cannot know for sure, however, how many chips we´ll need tomorrow.
More tests bring more interesting data to learn from, & sometimes surprise us :)
Looking at some smaller periods can
suggest what we may possibly expect in way of drawdowns, & how long we might expect a level period of no noticeable profit or loss to last -
for example, in my results, both March & April were slightly negative, so we can see that we might have 60 consecutive sessions without a noticeable profit, but due to more testing, we might expect it to turn +ve again at some point - giving us the motivation to carry on, even after 60 consecutive sessions where no profit has been obtained.
BUT, I agree, we cannot know how many chips we'll need tomorrow.
QuoteThe session always starts with the first spin of the day. We do not want to manipulate results :no: :no: by chossing another starting point.
I always start with the first spin of the day, play until a hit, & then move on to the first spin of the next day. All test results are from this.
I start the first day of each month on Table 2 & alternate from then on.
If there are no results from Table 2 on a particular day, I will try Table 3 & vice versa.
QuoteAnd I do not want to choose another table whenever I feel like it. Why are you alternating between table 2&3?
I like to see results from different sources, to show that it is not the source giving the results, but the strategy itself.
Different tables, different dealers, different dealers on different tables - all just adds to the impartiality of the results.
Perhaps the next 6 months a different casino could be tested.
It doesn't seem to have had an affect on the results so far, as can be seen from the similarity in our tests.
Thanks, monaco! We are both testing in a very systematic way. I stick to the same table (table 3, Spielbank Wiesbaden). It should make it easy for likeminded members to verify my results without any doubt.
I look forward to compare results later :)
Results from July 2011: 35 29 5 22-52 29 20 30-7-7 30 19 21 24-15-15 28 27-10 13 32 4-36-56-17 33 31 26-3 18-31 = 227.
Total 1041 u after just 209 hits.
:rose: :cheer: :whistle: :cheer: :rose:
No spin from 07.08.2011. First nine sessions from that August: 1 27 24 10 12 32 4 22 -36 = 96.
So right after 218 hits: +1137 units :whistle: . 1137/218 = 5.2155963. The 178 first sessions from monaco gave 1030 units. 1030/178 = 5.7865168. In time the average results are going to even out, I think.
Quote from: Dane on March 28, 2013, 08:36:08 AM
No spin from 07.08.2011. First nine sessions from that August: 1 27 24 10 12 32 4 22 -36 = 96.
So right after 218 hits: +1137 units :whistle: . 1137/218 = 5.2155963. The 178 first sessions from monaco gave 1030 units. 1030/178 = 5.7865168. In time the average results are going to even out, I think.
At the end of that August: Total +1203 units. 1203/239 = 5,0334728 :whistle:
@ Dane & monaco,
So far then in your testing it's setted on about 5 units per session then, at least for now.
I've started testing using Smartlive actuals, no particular dates just as posted on another forum.
Only 14 sessions so far and 28 points up. Time will tell if that pushes up to your average.
Trebor
[mod] A general request: On this forum (and this thread in particular) please could we all use a decimal point rather than a comma? Thus: 5.678 and not 5,678 which English speakers read as five thousand six hundred and seventy eight -- a big difference!! (I'm trying to help avoid confusion resulting from different numbering conventions. ;) ) Thanks. [/mod]
Quote from: esoito on March 28, 2013, 11:48:44 PM
A general request: On this forum (and this thread in particular) please could we all use a decimal point rather than a comma? Thus: 5.678 and not 5,678 which English speakers read as five thousand six hundred and seventy eight -- a big difference!! (I'm trying to help avoid confusion resulting from different numbering conventions. ;) ) Thanks.
Here in Denmark I am surrounded by ,,,,,,,,COMMANISTS,,,,,,, :nod: . But I´ll try to follow your conventions.
[Moderator: LOL...Just as well commanists don't exist here! Thanks for your positive response. :thumbsup: ]
My continued test series with the chosen lists from 2011 required much patience and (in theory) at least 300 units.
Right after 29.08. 1263 units
- - 13.09. 1061 -
- - 30.09 1061 -
- - 15.10. 1041 -
- - 16.10. 1007 -
- - 17.10. 971 -
- - 18.10. 1006 -
- - 19.10. 1033 -
- - 20.10. 1058 -
- - 21.10. 1053 -
- - 22.10. 1080 -
TOTAL: +1080 units right after 291 sessions or hits. 1080/291 = 3.7113402.
:nod:
13.11.2011: No spin
14.11.2011: +13
15.11.2011: +18. This is my 314th hit. Total: +1278 units. 1278/314 = 4.070 :whistle:
Quote from: Trebor on March 28, 2013, 08:56:03 PM
@ Dane & monaco,
So far then in your testing it's setted on about 5 units per session then, at least for now.
I've started testing using Smartlive actuals, no particular dates just as posted on another forum.
Only 14 sessions so far and 28 points up. Time will tell if that pushes up to your average.
Trebor
Hi Trebor. Thanks for testing too. As you can see, my average is now close to 4 units per session.
I've now done 45 sessions.
190 points total = 4.22 average.
With so few sessions the average is going up and down like a yo-yo, as low as 1 and up to 6.5.
Trebor
Jan-Jul 2012
Jan: +176
Feb: +282
Mar: -2
Apr: -29
May: +155
Jun: +448
Jul: -23
Total: +1007 in 209 sessions
(avg. 4.82)
The largest single session loss in July (& in all tests so far) was -146u.
Thanks for testing too Trebor.
A bit of confusion may occur....................
"Five repeaters in a row...."
Here in Obamaville, "in a row" can mean physical like "pretty ladies at the bar, all in a row" OR it can mean consecutive like "I threw three strikes in a row".
I assume when you guys say "row" you could have said "column", right. You are speaking about five double hits in a physical row--like row 1 thru 6, right? Not five consecutive.
Sam
Hello Sam,
I think in this context "five repeaters in a row" is referring to a line of five on the 6 x 6 matrix either horizontal or vertical, at least that is how I use it.
Trebor
Quote from: TwoCatSam on March 30, 2013, 11:23:44 AM
A bit of confusion may occur....................
"Five repeaters in a row...."
Here in Obamaville, "in a row" can mean physical like "pretty ladies at the bar, all in a row" OR it can mean consecutive like "I threw three strikes in a row".
I assume when you guys say "row" you could have said "column", right. You are speaking about five double hits in a physical row--like row 1 thru 6, right? Not five consecutive.
Sam
Looking for confusion again? As a true DYLANANIAC I like to listen to DESOLATION ROW.
No spin from 20.11.2011 in my test series. Right after my 326Th hit on 28.11.2011: 1375 units.
A new record did not come until 15.12.2011 together with my 343rd hit: 1389 units. 1389/343 = 4.0496.
And remember: Always Look On the Bright Side of Life :whistle: :whistle: :whistle:
Just so we're all clear about terminology:
A row = 5 5 5 5 5
A column =
5
5
5
5
5
Quote from: esoito on March 31, 2013, 09:16:10 AM
Just so we're all clear about terminology:
A row = 5 5 5 5 5
A column =
5
5
5
5
5
I am sorry for not using the right words in the first place! So the goal is at least four "oners" next to each other in a row and/or a column. On the horizontal and/or vertical level Or at least five repeated numbers next to each other...etc.
Are we able to continue testing?
70 Sessions
+192
= 2.74 average
Just suffered a -63 point loss which hit the average. Biggest single loss so far -112.
Trebor
Jan-Aug 2012
Jan: +176
Feb: +282
Mar: -2
Apr: -29
May: +155
Jun: +448
Jul: -23
Aug: +85
Total: +1092 in 240 sessions
(avg. 4.55)
Among the free lists (available on line) with winning numbers from Spielbank Wiesbaden are amazing ones from 24.12.2011 and 25.12.2011. See for yourself! I lost all units. I gave up analyzing all horizontal and vertical groups. And now I am looking at diagonal groups.
Would you believe that? Of course not! Not on the first day of April! You are not easily fooled. On the contrary you might participate (like Trebor and monaco) in what is beginning to look like scientific research. Or is it just foolish superstition and >:D Beginner´s Luck?
AT THE END OF THE YEAR (31.12.2011, table 3) I had my 357Th hit. Total: 1246 units. We don´t need a scientific calculator to see that the average per month is a bit more than 100 units in my test series. In thery I needed 300 units to get me through that year.
Monaco is using the lists from 2012. Without transcending Time I am choosing another year now: 2010.
Dane
89 sessions.
+263
= 2.95 average
Trebor
137 sessions.
+797
= 5.81 average per session
Trebor
Jan-Dec 2012
Jan: +176
Feb: +282
Mar: -2
Apr: -29
May: +155
Jun: +448
Jul: -23
Aug: +85
Sept: -195
Oct: +97
Nov: +368
Dec: +207
Total: +1569 in 358 sessions
(avg. 4.38)
largest single session loss: -155u
biggest drawdown from highest point: -271u
Similar results to those obtained by Dane for 2011 - a 300u bank would've been sufficient.
An average of about +130u per month, playing a single game per day.
good job
monaco
i go this aternoon at monaco town lol!
Quote from: monaco on April 04, 2013, 11:26:30 AM
Jan-Dec 2012
Jan: +176
Feb: +282
Mar: -2
Apr: -29
May: +155
Jun: +448
Jul: -23
Aug: +85
Sept: -195
Oct: +97
Nov: +368
Dec: +207
Total: +1569 in 358 sessions
(avg. 4.38)
largest single session loss: -155u
biggest drawdown from highest point: -271u
Similar results to those obtained by Dane for 2011 - a 300u bank would've been sufficient.
An average of about +130u per month, playing a single game per day.
Congratulations, monaco! I hope that we´ll be able to continue our test series. It is true that a 300u bank would´ve been sufficient for me for 2011. But I do not think it is a natural law. SOONER OR LATER A BIGGER DRAWDOWN MUST COME :scared: . It has already happened to me:
The highest point in my test series came with my 349Th hit (21.12.2011):1479u. I ended that year at 1246u. The twenty first sessions from my next chosen year (2010) made me 10 units richer. BUT THEN the next five days, sessions or hits made me drop 283 units. Be prepared to drop at least 500 units!
My total after 13 months (table 3, Spielbank Wiesbaden):1075 units.
Danr
205 sessions.
+911
+4.44 average
Trebor
455 sessions.
+670 :stress:
Be prepared to drop at least 800 units!
Dane,
Have you had many sessions with losses over 100?
In my 205 I've had
-119
-108
-112
-95
Trebor
Hi Trebor! I did not keep my old notes, so I am unable to tell you the number of losses over 100. I do not think I had many. Two losses over 50, however, must be as hard as one loss over 100. Four losses over 25 must be as hard as one over 100. And so forth and so on.
you should use a stop loss of 35 units
anything over that while flatbetting is pointless
Quote from: soggett on April 11, 2013, 09:16:29 AM
you should use a stop loss of 35 units
anything over that while flatbetting is pointless
Not necessarily soggett.
What about the times a hit with a stoploss of say 50 would result in a lesser loss.
In any case at the moment we are testing really to see how it goes.
Trebor
Just ran through all my losing sessions,
with no stoploss -2104
with 35 stoploss -2695
Quote from: Trebor on April 11, 2013, 07:27:39 PM
Just ran through all my losing sessions,
with no stoploss -2104
with 35 stoploss -2695
really?
wow
I thought you would have a better result
hmm....
well ok, back to the drawing board as they say :D
I did say "losing" sessions. If I include winning sessions my results are.
Sessions played 230.
Total +915
Average per session 3.97.
Trebor
These show the difference in my results [The -35u stoploss results can be out by a few units here & there, but they can be taken as fairly reliable approximations]:
No Stoploss: +1569 in 358 sessions (avg. 4.38)
Stoploss of -35u: +1383 in 358 sessions (avg. 3.86)
On a month-by-month basis:
No Stoploss -35u Stoploss
Jan: +176 +46
Feb: +282 +226
Mar: -2 -100
Apr: -29 +26
May: +155 +157
Jun: +448 +382
Jul: -23 -25
Aug: +85 +47
Sept: -195 -30
Oct: +97 +103
Nov: +368 +300
Dec: +207 +190
I've done about another 60 sessions comparing the results, & I think what the Stoploss will do in general is minimise the effect of the worse months, but also clip some units off the good/better months.
It may not affect the final result by much after 1000's of tests, but it may make it a smoother line getting there.
It would be interesting to see how much it could mitigate the effect of the losing sessions in Dane's tests. I might look at that now.
Is this ready to be botted? I'll pay.
Must have exact rules!
Sam
These are the rules as best I can explain (if I've got it wrong I hope Dane or monaco will correct me)
6 x 6 grid.
Bet on any number that would complete four in a row, vertically or horizontally, of numbers that have only appeared once.
If one of the three trigger numbers repeats the bet is cancelled.
Any number that repeats cannot again be part of these "oner" bets either as a trigger number or bet number.
Often three numbers might trigger two bets.
i.e. _ 2 3 4 _ _ would trigger bets on both 1 & 5.
Bet on any number that would complete five in a row, vertically or horizontally, of numbers that have repeated two or more times. These are "repeater" bets.
You can have both "repeaters" and "oners" at the same time although most sessions end with "oner" bets. They would of course be in separate lines.
Stop on first win.
Also explained with examples in monaco's post #38.
Trebor
Dane
You are right! I told monaco he was a gentleman and a scholar. Why? He answered the question without vitriolic comments. What have you got against a person wanting clarification? We're you born a genius who never had a question?
You may have the "Holy Grail". If so, you are a jerk with the "Holy Grail".
Sam
Moderator's Warning: Cool it, 2CS. NOBODY deserves to be referred to as a 'jerk' on this forum. You really should know better by now.
Kindly post an apology or accept the consequencies.
Trebor,
didn't you say me that the repeater bets must be different ?
4 repeater numbers and the fifth that completes it must be a one hitter ?
Stef
Hi all
Thanks to Dane for the system and all the guys whom are helping and making test
I have a question, if i got 6 _ _ 24-30-36 i have to bet on 18 right?
If i got 1 _ 13-19-25 _ Should i bet on 7 or 31??
Just to make sure if i'm doing it well
Thanks
http://betselection.cc/straight-up/dane%27s-%27tic-tac-toe%27-system/msg438/#msg438 (http://betselection.cc/straight-up/dane%27s-%27tic-tac-toe%27-system/msg438/#msg438)
MODS: Take a look at the above thread. Before this person came on this forum, I posted his system as he outlined it on the "other" forum. I had nothing but praise for his intelligence.
I have used that simple system time and time again at Riverwind and I HAVE NEVER LOST WITH IT!
As to the new one, I am testing it now. I have never said one harsh word to this person and he has no call to speak to me like I'm some moron who can't understand anything.
We have a varied number of languages on these forums. All I was trying to do was seek clarification.
I will give you an example:
In America, the dentist cleans the tartar from our teeth. We then eat fish and tartar sauce! That could be confusing, no?
You have no reason to delete this post unless you are absolutely against free speech on this forum.
TwoCat
Quote from: leknightroulette on April 12, 2013, 11:13:16 PM
Hi all
Thanks to Dane for the system and all the guys whom are helping and making test
I have a question, if i got 6 _ _ 24-30-36 i have to bet on 18 right?
If i got 1 _ 13-19-25 _ Should i bet on 7 or 31??
Just to make sure if i'm doing it well
Thanks
Hi; if 24-30-36 have not repeated: Yes you have to bet 18. Well begun is half done
And you should bet on both 7 and 31, if all the mentioned numbers in the column are "oners". The goal is still at least four oners next to each other or at least five repeated numbers next to each other. If you have a bit of patience, you´ll soon be able to practice. But never say never! Losing might just take a little longer, as some of my own sessions have shown. Good luck!
Dane
Quote from: Stepkevh on April 12, 2013, 09:21:04 PM
Trebor,
didn't you say me that the repeater bets must be different ?
4 repeater numbers and the fifth that completes it must be a one hitter ?
Stef
I think I'm just not very good at explaining it.
If you have four repeater numbers and a fifth number that has appeared once, all in a row, then that number is bet hoping it will form a row of five repeaters.
Trebor
:thumbsup: that's the way i coded the sheet :thumbsup:
I've modified my post #111
Trebor
Right after my 476Th hit (April 2010): 760 units :stress: . Long test series still requires much patience.
You've been on a sustained downward trend for a while now Dane, I think your high point was at about session 350 or so.
On the up side it's still in profit. I'm hoping you will start an upward trend soom. These things always go in cycles.
Trebor
Quote from: Trebor on April 13, 2013, 06:53:42 PM
You've been on a sustained downward trend for a while now Dane, I think your high point was at about session 350 or so.
On the up side it's still in profit. I'm hoping you will start an upward trend soom. These things always go in cycles.
Trebor
True, Trebor! And life itself goes in cycles! Have you ever heard of CYCLIC PSYCHOSIS? There is a time for everything. 732 units after just 500 hits. To me it seems like a good time to leave. Thanks to all sane and balanced participants taking their time to read and think.
:rose: :rose:
Quote from: Dane on April 13, 2013, 08:43:12 AM
Hi; if 24-30-36 have not repeated: Yes you have to bet 18. Well begun is half done
And you should bet on both 7 and 31, if all the mentioned numbers in the column are "oners". The goal is still at least four oners next to each other or at least five repeated numbers next to each other. If you have a bit of patience, you´ll soon be able to practice. But never say never! Losing might just take a little longer, as some of my own sessions have shown. Good luck!
Dane
Thanks Dane :thumbsup:
Hello all. My name is Javier, from Spain. :)
This system looks very interesting. I have done some tries with good results, but not enough, of course.
What do you think? How are your results now? Still good?
Thank your for your efforts. :applause:
JavierTT
What ever you do, do call him the "J" word!!
And don't play this system. I have it botted and it loses big time.
That is from a "sane and balanced" member.
Sam
After good initial gains I've been standing still for what seems ages. Gaining some, losing some. All flat betting.
From my results and those of Dane and monaco I saw it as very long term so I got it botted. I have found out that even with a bot doing the work it gets very boring (also my Dublinbet bot can't be left for more than one hour on it's own).
I need my computer for other things as well.
@Sam. Are your results with progression? Every attempt I made at some sort of progression in testing was a disaster.
Trebor
It seems it do not work, nothing works in roulette!!! :nope: :nope: :nope: If somebody could code it in RX...
Trebor
I used a D'Alembert. I got far too many losses vs wins.
Sam
My results were still slowly creeping up, though Danes losses made me take a step back.
I played it for real on Dublinbet and was up until all the connection problems & bets not being taken.
Taking the results of Dane, Trebor &myself, it was still up a couple of thousand units before the wind was taken out the sails slightly.
2CS - I didn't realize you'd botted it, flat betting it tanked badly?
The only progression i tried was the Guetting - you would need to scale the unit size of the increase to the size of loss if you were going try the d'alembert I think, though I'm still not sure that would work.
I think the 'oner' part of the bet has merit, don't want to throw the baby out with the bath water, part of a straight-up strategy maybe..
I'm still playing this monaco, but not as much as I was.
In testing I reached 915 points in 265 sessions which is 3.52 per session, all flat betting. This was on mostly Dublinbet actuals.
The last few weeks I've been playing for real on Dublinbet but getting nowhere fast. I'm still hovering around break even so I'll carry on and hope it's just a bad spell.
Thinking I need to apply a lower stop loss, maybe even the -35 you suggested in an earlier post.
Trebor
monaco
I think someone else ordered the sheet for the bot. I just happen to have it.
Sam
Quote from: Trebor on May 10, 2013, 06:53:12 PM
The last few weeks I've been playing for real on Dublinbet but getting nowhere fast. I'm still hovering around break even so I'll carry on and hope it's just a bad spell.
Thinking I need to apply a lower stop loss, maybe even the -35 you suggested in an earlier post.
Trebor
We saw from some of our tests that 60 or 70 sessions & more (a couple of months at a session a day) can hover around break-even or even drop some.. how many games do you reckon you've actually played with no progress?
I'm still not sure about the stop-loss. I guess it won't turn a losing system into a winning one, but it might take away the pain of a big loss on any given day.
monaco,
I'm not keeping records (maybe should) but I think about 30 sessions or so.
It should be more with the bot but I can't leave it to run multiple sessions on Dublinbet until Stef sorts out the popup. I'm hoping he will soon.
It's a bit frustrating as I thought with the bot 'd be knocking out 10 or more sessions a day, then it would have 300 sessions or so.
Trebor